Ship discussion

posted on December 3rd, 2010, 11:11 pm

lol, there's almost no information in my words there - how can you look forward to / not look forward to something so empty of any information

[Tok`ra]

posted on December 3rd, 2010, 11:43 pm

Last edited by Tok`ra on December 3rd, 2010, 11:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The Canaveral is a Federation vessel. The Phalanx is a Starfleet-proper vessel. The Marines is a division of the U.S. armed forces, but it is not the U.S. armed forces, and it has a different combat role.

Dom, they're all starfleet. Saying it's a Federation vessel is the same as saying a Royal Navy vessel is a British vessel.

While I'm sure some Federation agencies other than starfleet, and local goverments too, have some smaller federation ships of their own (mostly shuttles and runabouts, prolly up to a few larger ships) there is by and large no difference. If it's Federation, it's starfleet.

What I think you're trying to say is that they have separate commands, which means some rarer ships may or may not be under the command of one of them.

Just to clarify, Optec is the one that classified the Canaveral this way.  It's supposed to be a non-Starfleet vessel not technically under Starfleet control.  For example, a Canaveral might be assigned to Risa, and Risa dictates what the vessel does and where it goes, not starfleet.  That way the planetary government has a dedicated ship for taking out pirates or other scum.

It's built from starfleet shipyards, so the whole thing is confusing to me.  This is how I understand it.

Basicly, it's a federation vessel design. Most of them are starfleet, but smaller ones would be relegated to system based defences, as patrol vessels and the like. Same as how some ships may be assigned to a scientific organization to conduct research.
It's all starfleet, however starfleet does more than just explore, they also do the space version of garrison duty, they're just 'there' to react if something happens, from a SOS to a pirate attack.

posted on December 3rd, 2010, 11:47 pm

Federation and Starfleet aren't interchangeable; Starfleet is the military arm of the Federation, civilian vessels are not Starfleet. Federation Science vessels (and other civilian ones) often work with Starfleet, not for them.

posted on December 3rd, 2010, 11:48 pm

If they were not in starfleet, they wouldn't be available in numbers to Mayson or Risner.

posted on December 3rd, 2010, 11:51 pm

Starfleet is a branch of the Federation - not the other way around Tok'ra. Your example should be Royal Navy is to Starfleet as British vessel is to Federation . Not all Federation vessels are owned by Starfleet, nor do they necessarily fall under Starfleet jurisdiction. Starfleet has its own agencies and ships that are not necessarily privy to being used by officers like Mayson, who are really more like Federation diplomats rather than career Starfleet officers.

Ninja'd by Tyler

[Tyler]

posted on December 3rd, 2010, 11:56 pm

Last edited by Tyler on December 3rd, 2010, 11:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

If they were not in starfleet, they wouldn't be available in numbers to Mayson or Risner.

Construction and Mining ship are Federation not Starfleet, there's also the part about civilians working with Starfleet. They take orders from the one who has highest authority, which would be Starfleet during conflicts.

Not to mention Starfleet Yards build Starfleets own version of the Canaveral, which was adopted by them for their own use. Civilian ones probably wouldn't have the same stats as the buildable one.

posted on December 4th, 2010, 12:02 am

Starfleet is a branch of the Federation - not the other way around Tok'ra. Your example should be Royal Navy is to Starfleet as British vessel is to Federation . Not all Federation vessels are owned by Starfleet, nor do they necessarily fall under Starfleet jurisdiction. Starfleet has its own agencies and ships that are not necessarily privy to being used by officers like Mayson, who are really more like Federation diplomats rather than career Starfleet officers.

Ninja'd by Tyler

Not to mention Starfleet Yards build Starfleets own version of the Canaveral, which was adopted by them for their own use. Civilian ones probably wouldn't have the same stats as the buildable one.

If they were not in starfleet, they wouldn't be available in numbers to Mayson or Risner.

posted on December 4th, 2010, 12:04 am

That was random...

posted on December 4th, 2010, 12:06 am

Not really, you yourself said what I've been saying.

There may be civie versions of some of the smaller ships, but their stats would be different.

All I've been saying is that if it's starfleet, its military.

If it's federation, it could be anything.

Starfleet vessels are always Federation vessels, but Federation vessels are not always starfleet vessels.

posted on December 4th, 2010, 12:11 am

Saying that all Federation ships are Starfleet isn't quite the same.

posted on December 4th, 2010, 12:22 am

Saying that all Federation ships are Starfleet isn't quite the same.

And I didnt say that.

Starfleet vessels are always Federation vessels, but Federation vessels are not always starfleet vessels.

[Tyler]

posted on December 4th, 2010, 12:23 am

Last edited by Tyler on December 4th, 2010, 12:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

Dom, they're all starfleet. Saying it's a Federation vessel is the same as saying a Royal Navy vessel is a British vessel.

If it's Federation, it's starfleet.

It's all starfleet, however starfleet does more than just explore, they also do the space version of garrison duty, they're just 'there' to react if something happens, from a SOS to a pirate attack.

posted on December 4th, 2010, 5:23 am

Context, Tyler.

If it's a mass produced combat vessel in use by starfleet, guess what it is. 

posted on December 4th, 2010, 8:21 am

Context, Tyler.

If it's a mass produced combat vessel in use by starfleet, guess what it is. 

.......Klingon? 

posted on December 4th, 2010, 9:49 am

Context, Tyler.

If it's a mass produced combat vessel in use by starfleet, guess what it is. 

You said 3 times in a single post that Federation = Starfleet and that they are all Starfleet ships. Historical revisionism doesn't work during the discussion.