Your own ship...

posted on December 29th, 2009, 7:28 pm

who would want to hide though, with shields that powerful you could hide underwater remember? water dissipates weapons a bit. i mean the borg obviously dont mind a being big target because they are strong enough to take the fire. i would feel a lot safer in a city ship than in an aurora type ship.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 7:37 pm

Besides, you can hide when things go bad, because it has a cloak!

That show had so much potential and instead they made crappy scifi out of it.  Or should I say SyFy.   All we ever heard was "Wow, we could really kick ass if we had some power".  "I think we need some power.  That would really kick ass."  "Crap!  We're getting our asses kicked because we have no power!"  Oh, and Ronan shoots people with his gun.

There you go.  If you've never watched Stargate:  Atlantis, I've just let you experience all five seasons so you won't have wasted your time.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 7:42 pm

you can only cloak when theres atmosphere cos the shields fail when u cloak. but u can cloak sometimes.

and ronan shooting ppl is all i need, i loved the episode sateda where ronan shot all everyone. and the one with teal'c helping him shoot all everyone, serves midway right for not having an iris.

time to attack some plot holes, the asuran replicators were the bad guys, and exterminating their race is ok, they did so after a while, but why didnt they do it faster by getting the tainted zpm from the sgc, remember the one that would blow up when used cos it was booby trapped. send that through to asuras and KA-BOOM. replicator problem solved.?

EDIT: oh and here in britainland sci fi never renamed itself i dont think

posted on December 29th, 2009, 7:45 pm

It's way more effective to use nukes that don't work in the end, so that Ronan has more of an excuse to shoot people with his gun.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 7:46 pm

Bigger target = easier to hit = more damage on average. Anyone who wants to live would hide if things don't go your way, powerful shields are not invincible shields. Lose them, and you will wish you didn't command the one thing easier to hit than a Cube.

The Borg don't mind being a big target because they are arrogant enough to assume they cannot be harmed by the 'imperfect' races around them.

Your faith in the power of the cityship happens to be one of the things that doomed the arrogant Lanteans, they felt safe with the biggest and the best and paid dearly for it.

Besides, you can hide when things go bad, because it has a cloak!

I would take a good old sensor-screwing Nebula over a cloak, the enemy can't disable that and a cloak doesn't prevent you from being rammed by accident (then again, neither does a Nebula). That can be more damaging than many weapons and the Cloak also takes power to use.

time to attack some plot holes, the asuran replicators were the bad guys, and exterminating their race is ok, they did so after a while, but why didnt they do it faster by getting the tainted zpm from the sgc, remember the one that would blow up when used cos it was booby trapped. send that through to asuras and KA-BOOM. replicator problem solved.?

They probably disposed of it to prevent it from being stolen and used against them.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 7:58 pm

atlantis was so good it was never destroyed, they lost the war beacause of their arrogance yes, but the city ship when fully powered really was close to invincible. the wraith couldnt destroy atlantis, the ancients left because they couldnt win the war, but atlantis lasted 10,000 years so far already.

and if the shields failed you would explosively decompress before the enemy got around to vapourising you.

yes atlantis is easy to hit, but all the time the enemy is hitting the shields, drones are damaging them. atlantis deals more damage per damage it receives.

hiding is effective at avoiding damage, but it doesnt help you win. because when you come out of hiding your enemy will just continue pasting you.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 8:07 pm

Here's the real question:  Atlantis Vs. Deathstar.  Who would win?  In a conventional fight, does the flying city with drones and super strong shields win?  Or the small moon that can one-shot planets?  Oh, and the Deathstar has protected its exhaust port so you can't fire drones into it.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 8:12 pm

different univserse, so its hard to say, i would bet deathstar due to the crazy ability to destroy planets. and i hate star wars. then again how good is the targeting of a death star, planets move predictably, atlantis might fly around keeping away from the death stars weapon.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 8:15 pm

Come to think of it, Atlantis might be able to zip in, fire at the Deathstar's main gun and destroy it.  Once it's knocked out, it would be pretty easy after that.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 8:16 pm

how well armed is the death star other than the planet gun, ive never watched star wars so i dont know.

[Tyler]

posted on December 29th, 2009, 8:17 pm

Last edited by Tyler on December 29th, 2009, 8:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

atlantis was so good it was never destroyed, they lost the war beacause of their arrogance yes, but the city ship when fully powered really was close to invincible. the wraith couldnt destroy atlantis, the ancients left because they couldnt win the war, but atlantis lasted 10,000 years so far already.

It was only on low power and not being attacked, so it wasn't having much of a problem until the shields started running low. A city running at full during a battle would be using a bit more power. Providing the enemy wasn't able to sabotage the thing at the start.

yes atlantis is easy to hit, but all the time the enemy is hitting the shields, drones are damaging them. atlantis deals more damage per damage it receives.

Depends who you're fighting and how powerful the ship is. Atlantis has more firepower than the known Stargate ships, but there are many Galaxies that Stargate didn't explore.

hiding is effective at avoiding damage, but it doesnt help you win. because when you come out of hiding your enemy will just continue pasting you.

If you use the hiding time to repair or set up a plan of attack, that becomes less of a problem. So, hiding does help you win.  The Wrath of Kahn should have shown you that...

Anyway, why are we debating each others ship preferences? I prefer 1, you'd prefer another. Not like we really need to 'justify' it...

how well armed is the death star other than the planet gun, ive never watched star wars so i dont know.

It's a moon-sized Battlestation with most of it's exterior armed.

[Myles]

posted on December 29th, 2009, 8:28 pm

Last edited by Myles on December 29th, 2009, 8:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

the enterprise was equal strengthish to the reliant though, if kirk hadnt made the rookie mistakes early in the battle they could have just won in a straight fight.

there's always unknown powerful enemies out there. the question is what ship would you most want to be in command of? (assuming peak performance and top crew)

i would pick atlantis due to it being more powerful than anything seen in stargate. the shields held an ocean back for 10,000 years, the shields are presumably similar tech to destiny which can fly through a star.

the weapons are also formidable, we never saw atlantis firing full drones, in the last episode carson was inexperienced and had limited power under attack both from superhive and a planets atmoshere which he stupidly got into. we can assume atlantis drone system is comparable to the earth antarctic drone system, which could collapse an ori motherships shields and destroy it, and could also destroy the superhive. if atlantis was working at peak performance it has the joint strongest weapons we've seen. which makes sense as its a flying city built by tech clever people. (idiots when it comes to war though )

also important would be enjoyment, i would enjoy a flying city, because i could land and have huge quarters and have all the ameneties of a flying city. no holodeck though

thats why i personally would choose atlantis if i could have any ship.

although i can see things from your side too, stargate ships do all look fun, i would definitely enjoy an o'neill class

posted on December 30th, 2009, 6:59 pm

Am I seeing "it's a big target therefore easier to hit."?  That is true in star wars but not in Trek or even really Stargate (ZPM powered hive hit and severely damaged a cloaked puddle jumper after only five or so shots)  Even a modern targeting system connected to a beam weapon could probably track most ships in Stargate and Star Trek perfectly.  There is a major disadvantage to being so huge as the larger the shield the more power needed (at least in stargate canon, not sure about star trek canon.)  As far as Death Star vs. Atlantis I think atlantis would win since it could fly around the Death Star's main laser firing arc, but it might get severely damaged by the many turbolaser towers seen on the Death Star in Episode IV, it would probably win because its drones ignore shielding and tear things apart, and since drones can change direction, one could easily go down the exhaust port and take it out same as luke.  Even without achilles exhaust port trick the drones would still tear through the death star interior.

[Tyler]

posted on December 30th, 2009, 7:14 pm

Last edited by Tyler on December 30th, 2009, 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

That 'drones through shields' argument is not something known and is completly baseless. Stargate has already shown ships can resist them, and we don't know how they'd react to Star Wars shields, which are very likely different to the ones in Stargate.

Assuming they pass all shields without knowing how the tech matches up (which will never be known, aside from the fact that the shields are almost certainly different to the ones those Drones usually pass through) makes as much sense as a post I saw in a YouTube 'Star Trek Vs Babylon 5' video before that pretty much translated into "The Excalibur main gun 1-shotted a B5 ship before, so it can defeat any ST ship in seconds with the same gun'.

[Nebula_Class_Ftw]

posted on December 30th, 2009, 7:31 pm

Last edited by Nebula_Class_Ftw on December 30th, 2009, 7:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

They do go through Goa'uld shields http://stargate.wikia.com/wiki/Drone_weapon but for the Death Star they do not even need to, the shields on the Death Star exhaust port are ray shields http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Ray_shield, not particle shields, that is how the proton torpedoes luke fired got through (ray shields stop lasers and ion shots but are useless against projectile weapons such as missiles, particle shields stop projectiles.)  It seems likely that drones would go through ray shields in the same way that the torpedoes did.