Breen Cruiser may be underpowered.

posted on September 8th, 2010, 7:54 am

Fleet Operations does not use the same basic pattern for all factions. Each faction has its own gameplay and set of strategies. Therefore you cant simply compare one unit of one faction to one of another faction, as they follow completely different balancing fundamentals. A fast hit-and-run unit might be more valuable to a hit-and-run-focused faction than to a bunker-faction, for example.
If you find yourself thinking a certain faction to be underpowered, try playing a different one that supports your playstyle more. just experiment around and you will find the "sweet spot" of all ships and factions, and you will find the combo that suits you the most

posted on September 8th, 2010, 8:00 am

If you find yourself thinking a certain faction to be underpowered, try playing a different one that supports your playstyle more. just experiment around and you will find the "sweet spot" of all ships and factions, and you will find the combo that suits you the most

Indeed, this is the problem i'm facing learning the Klingons.  I'm a defensive player by nature so Feds suited me fine.  I'm now trying to adapt to the Klingon play style.

So, actually I would argue differently.  I would not suggest just learning those races that suit you, but learn how to play in the style of all races.  Certainly for online play this is important.  If you become known as a one-trick pony then people you play against, if they are good, will simply employ strategies that beat you every time even if you have your favourite race/strat that works against lesser players.

Once you know all races and different strats then you become more unpredictable and your opponents really have to be ready for anything.

posted on September 8th, 2010, 8:01 am

why dont u download a previous patch if u want breen ships to pwn everything. you obviously dont play online so u dont need to be on the latest patch. in previous patches breen ships were ridiculously op. which seems to be what you want from them.

I dont want breen ships to be ridiculious overpowered units.I want them to be like in DS9


I studied this breen Warship intesively for some days and this is what discovered


Theres only one type of Breen Battleship/Warship
It have Disruptors,not Phasers like in FO
The Crew count is much lower than if FO,probably around 250.
It have Cloak
Its faster than Defiant
Medium or Short range would fit it much more acurately as seen in DS9
It can fire some sort of bolt or rocket at short range that disable all subsystem for long time.
Probably not all Breen Ships have this device and its rather of limited nature this device.(long recharge/low ammo?)

posted on September 8th, 2010, 10:45 am

FO id ocean of bugs and unbalanced unit...    I just express my opinion about these things

if u think fo is so awful then dont play

I want these changes to be official,so I can play MP with other people

i can almost guarantee that they wont happen, the breen ships used to be like what u want of them, everyone complained because they were op. thats why they were balanced. what u want is for fo to go backwards.

I dont want breen ships to be ridiculious overpowered units.I want them to be like in DS9

that sentence is a contradiction of itself. the breen ships in ds9 were op

Theres only one type of Breen Battleship/Warship

says canon, there is no monsoon in canon, but we have that. this is a fan made game, fans have the right to extrapolate from canon to make more ships.

otherwise the romulans would have 3 ships, the small science ship, the big d, and the valdore-type (we dont know its canon name) 3 ships lol, definitely not fun for a game.

the dominion would have bugs, v13, v15, 1 breen ship and a karemma transport. those are the only canon ships we saw.
dont mention cardy ships, canon established that the cardassians rebelled and left the dominion. and the dominion retreated to gamma quadrant.

It have Disruptors,not Phasers like in FO

we never saw a breen ship fire any weapon other than torps. energy dissipating torps or standard explody torps. we heard a reference to breen disruptors once in tng, but for all we know they use disruptors for handheld use and phasers for ships. this is another example of limited canon.

The Crew count is much lower than if FO,probably around 250.

then it would be assimilated easily and be useless against borg.

It have Cloak

that wasnt in canon either. but i like having the cloak only for the cruiser.

Its faster than Defiant

anything as fast and powerful than a defiant needs to be short ranged. we had long range ships with good speed before. it led to kiting. lots of kiting.

Medium or Short range would fit it much more acurately as seen in DS9

actually canon is inconsistent on that, we saw it engage at long range in ds9. same range as other ships like excel.

It can fire some sort of bolt or rocket at short range that disable all subsystem for long time.
Probably not all Breen Ships have this device and its rather of limited nature this device.(long recharge/low ammo?)

so op. basically a torp that can 1 shot a ship. a disabled ship might as well have been destroyed. as it will die after the battle anyway.

posted on September 8th, 2010, 2:37 pm

Did Myles just talk about arbitrary weapon range in Star Trek? FO weapon ranges are for game balance, most of them have nothing to do with canon, except for some like the FO range on the Intrepid, which is just based on the result of the "Sci fi writers have no sense of scale" trope being used in Voyager.
You talked about the Excelsior being long-ranged, but there was no evidence it could fire farther than other ships in Star Trek AFAIK.

posted on September 8th, 2010, 2:59 pm

Did Myles just talk about arbitrary weapon range in Star Trek? FO weapon ranges are for game balance, most of them have nothing to do with canon, except for some like the FO range on the Intrepid, which is just based on the result of the "Sci fi writers have no sense of scale" trope being used in Voyager.
You talked about the Excelsior being long-ranged, but there was no evidence it could fire farther than other ships in Star Trek AFAIK.

nope i was talking about inconsistencies in star trek ranges in general.

if u look at the battle the breen ship fires from the same range as the whole fleets do when approaching. ie that if u believe canon it has a good range anyway. but also that canon isnt very consistent anway, so range can be whatever game makers want it to be

posted on September 9th, 2010, 2:38 am

I only use the Breen Cruiser if im against Borg as I hate the miss rate it has against other factions early game ships, the other buildable ships in the yard are better in early game and I hate using breen cruisers in the late game but thats just personal preference

[dob]

posted on September 9th, 2010, 4:05 am

Last edited by dob on September 9th, 2010, 4:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

if u think fo is so awful then dont play
I said numerous times that I love FO even with its problems

i can almost guarantee that they wont happen, the breen ships used to be like what u want of them, everyone complained because they were op. thats why they were balanced. what u want is for fo to go backwards.
I dont want to go backward,I reqest changes that were not there before,thats way forward

that sentence is a contradiction of itself. the breen ships in ds9 were op
In ds9 yes but good skilled game desinger can make this ship balanced but without changing its soul
Breen is fast,cloaked,torp warship with special shutdown all subsystem weapon.All these elements can be transported to game without killing teh balance


says canon, there is no monsoon in canon, but we have that. this is a fan made game, fans have the right to extrapolate from canon to make more ships.
I only agree

otherwise the romulans would have 3 ships, the small science ship, the big d, and the valdore-type (we dont know its canon name) 3 ships lol, definitely not fun for a game.
and what about Scimitar,Norexan,Talvath??? but I agree,lets make new ships

the dominion would have bugs, v13, v15, 1 breen ship and a karemma transport. those are the only canon ships we saw.
dont mention cardy ships, canon established that the cardassians rebelled and left the dominion. and the dominion retreated to gamma quadrant.

we never saw a breen ship fire any weapon other than torps. energy dissipating torps or standard explody torps. we heard a reference to breen disruptors once in tng, but for all we know they use disruptors for handheld use and phasers for ships. this is another example of limited canon.

thats right but I think if they are one of the three races that use type III disruptors like Klingons and Romulans,it would be suite them better

then it would be assimilated easily and be useless against borg.
yet more realistic and good game balance for changes that I want

that wasnt in canon either. but i like having the cloak only for the cruiser.
It was in book,Ferengi sold Breen cloak technolodgy before Dominion war and becose there is only one official type of Breen ship,the Breen Warship,that the one who should have cloak.Theres already big number of cloak battleships,put in Breen Warship too

anything as fast and powerful than a defiant needs to be short ranged. we had long range ships with good speed before. it led to kiting. lots of kiting.
It dont need to be fast like defiant,just faster than current version

actually canon is inconsistent on that, we saw it engage at long range in ds9. same range as other ships like excel.  I didnt saw that one,what episode that was?

so op. basically a torp that can 1 shot a ship. a disabled ship might as well have been destroyed. as it will die after the battle anyway.     
image this,very long recharge time long range special,its missile that shut down all subsystems except life suport for something around 5 seconds.Also the research would be like 1200 dil 2000 trit avaliable after you build all buildings,effective,fun to use,close to the DS9 version and not overpowered

posted on September 9th, 2010, 5:13 am

@dob - please learn how to use the quote function.  It makes reading your dissections of other people's posts most confusing.

posted on September 9th, 2010, 5:34 am

The point of the Breen in DS9 was that they were ridiculously overpowered.

Just sayin'.

[Elim]

posted on September 9th, 2010, 5:41 am

Last edited by Elim on September 9th, 2010, 5:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

I dont complain,I request 

FO id ocean of bugs and unbalanced unit...    I just express my opinion about these things

Well, I don't wanted to write in this topic again, but this statemant clearly shows that you didn't played enough online, and you have no clue what you are talking about.   :sweatdrop:

I think there are really only some minor glitches (warpin, spectres, b-8 aginst klingons etc.) left, I guess after the next patch the online gameplay will be very close to perfection.

posted on September 9th, 2010, 5:46 am

i guess after the next patch the online gameplay will be very close to perfection.

LOL, I was agreeing with you right until that last sentence. 

As we understand the next patch will bring a rework of the Borg and mixed tech... its going to open new cans of worms i think.

posted on September 9th, 2010, 5:52 am

LOL, I was agreeing with you right until that last sentence. 

As we understand the next patch will bring a rework of the Borg and mixed tech... its going to open new cans of worms i think.

Yeah, sadly  you might be right about that.   

posted on September 9th, 2010, 6:58 am

@dob - please learn how to use the quote function.  It makes reading your dissections of other people's posts most confusing.

I am sorry for that,so how can I quote multiple pieces of post?

posted on September 9th, 2010, 7:04 am

The point of the Breen in DS9 was that they were ridiculously overpowered.

Just sayin'.

The point of any Federation ship in any Star Trek from serials to movies was that they were ridiculously overpowered.

Just sayin'.



Dreadnaught for example is most powerfull ship that ever was in Star Trek,super overpowered and yet it wasnt difficult to put it in game with balance.