What do you think will/would happen to the Cardassians (post
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posted on June 21st, 2010, 2:15 am
I've heard allot of theories on this, such as them joining the Federation (unlikely as they were/are a very proud people who just finished fighting to escape from the last large interstellar Empire they joined), them rebuilding in a sort of Marshall plan under Gerak (which would make for a significant change in the way a new Cardassian Union would be governed, not to mention the changes to culture itself under a Federation influenced rebuilding), or even them giving up all aspirations to becoming a major power again and just becoming a small collection of a few planets here and there.
What do you all think and why?
What do you all think and why?
posted on June 21st, 2010, 2:26 am
Last edited by Tyler on June 21st, 2010, 2:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
From what I remember, I think some will be working with the Federation to rebuilt (the Federation can't help trying to influence potential memberships) while some will try to return to the old ways.
Considering their condition and how slow rebuilding's going even with Federation help (they're barely a minor power), the old ways won't be much of a problem. Not unless they suddenly pull a Kentar on us.
Considering their condition and how slow rebuilding's going even with Federation help (they're barely a minor power), the old ways won't be much of a problem. Not unless they suddenly pull a Kentar on us.
posted on June 21st, 2010, 9:19 am
Depends on the timeline. The most consistent(-ish) one, the novels up 'till right around Nemesis, have the Cardassians slowly rebuilding under Garak with the aid of the Federation.
posted on June 21st, 2010, 10:32 am
i think they are slowly rebuilding, with federation aid.
we know for certain very few things:
- they have a fleet, we saw at the end of ds9 finale that the cardy fleet had switched sides, and that it was still rather large. not as big as the other members of the alliance, but at minimum 50 ships, i would bet more around 200-300
- their homeworld of cardassia prime was flattened from orbit, so all people on cardassia prime are most likely dead.
what we dont know is whether the founder's orders to kill all cardassians was executed on the numerous other cardassian worlds in the union. it seems unlikely that the jem'hadar could kill all the other worlds as its reasonable to assume they were all lining up in front of cardassia prime to block the alliance fleet. so if we assume that ONLY cardassia prime, one planet among many, was flattened, then the cardassians would still be a force, not as strong as fed or kling or roms, but not weak either. probably with just enough forces to defend against an attack by someone other than fed kling or rom.
if we assume that somehow the founders replicated the destruction on other cardassian worlds, maybe they had turrets in orbit, or each planet had a very small contingent of jem'hadar which were enough to wipe out all the cardies on those worlds. under this assumption, most cardassian civilians are dead, so the crews of those ships which switched sides would be all thats left. meaning cardassia would not be able to operate a large fleet, as their crews would have to be rebuilding. this would go with the assumption that cardassia cant field a large fleet at all. maybe they dismantled ships to rebuild.
we know for certain very few things:
- they have a fleet, we saw at the end of ds9 finale that the cardy fleet had switched sides, and that it was still rather large. not as big as the other members of the alliance, but at minimum 50 ships, i would bet more around 200-300
- their homeworld of cardassia prime was flattened from orbit, so all people on cardassia prime are most likely dead.
what we dont know is whether the founder's orders to kill all cardassians was executed on the numerous other cardassian worlds in the union. it seems unlikely that the jem'hadar could kill all the other worlds as its reasonable to assume they were all lining up in front of cardassia prime to block the alliance fleet. so if we assume that ONLY cardassia prime, one planet among many, was flattened, then the cardassians would still be a force, not as strong as fed or kling or roms, but not weak either. probably with just enough forces to defend against an attack by someone other than fed kling or rom.
if we assume that somehow the founders replicated the destruction on other cardassian worlds, maybe they had turrets in orbit, or each planet had a very small contingent of jem'hadar which were enough to wipe out all the cardies on those worlds. under this assumption, most cardassian civilians are dead, so the crews of those ships which switched sides would be all thats left. meaning cardassia would not be able to operate a large fleet, as their crews would have to be rebuilding. this would go with the assumption that cardassia cant field a large fleet at all. maybe they dismantled ships to rebuild.
posted on June 21st, 2010, 11:02 am
If the Dominion would have made a genocide with the Cardassians, we would know that, they would have told us in the movies or at the end of DS9. I think even Cardassia Prime is still alive, they didn't tell anything else and got the female founder quite fast. You can't wipe out a planet that fast. Cardassia seemst bo be destroyed, their economy is presumably bad due to concentration on war, but I think with Garak and Colonel Kira they will get help. The Detapa council was already a civil one, perhaps they implement it again.
More of a question is what happened to the Dominion
.
More of a question is what happened to the Dominion
.posted on June 21st, 2010, 11:06 am
actually, they had numerous weapons platforms and probably several ships in orbit of cardassia prime, and we saw in DS9: The Die is Cast that it doesnt take that many ships to kill any life on a planet, the jem'hadar easily possessed enough firepower to destroy all life on cardassia prime. the question i posed is whether they had to ability to destroy life on all the other cardassian planets.
all we know about the dominion for certain is that they abandoned cardassia and left the alpha quadrant, they were all forced back into the gamma quadrant. they presumably still have a strong presence in the gamma quadrant, even if their entire gamma quadrant fleet was destroyed in sacrifice of angels, they had 2 years to rebuild a fleet. so the dominion isnt gone. odo did join the great link to cure them and try convince them that solids arent gonna eat them. maybe the dominion will give up on invading everyone.
all we know about the dominion for certain is that they abandoned cardassia and left the alpha quadrant, they were all forced back into the gamma quadrant. they presumably still have a strong presence in the gamma quadrant, even if their entire gamma quadrant fleet was destroyed in sacrifice of angels, they had 2 years to rebuild a fleet. so the dominion isnt gone. odo did join the great link to cure them and try convince them that solids arent gonna eat them. maybe the dominion will give up on invading everyone.
posted on June 21st, 2010, 11:04 pm
I highly doubt that the genocide on Cardassia was anywhere close to 'there are no Cardassians left alive there'. Also keep in mind that the Dominion only had a few short hours to do this in as they JUST got long range commucations back after the Cardassian Fleet switched sides.
The Capital and several major cities were destroyed, and millions of civilians on Cardassia died. I doubt much if any damage was done on the other Cardassian worlds and, as I said, I highly doubt that the Genocide killed as many as you claim. Do you really thing an overstretched Army and a Navy that could spare NO ONE due to the battle above, could wipe out EVERYONE on Cardassia Prime in 3 - 4 hours?
I'd wager that just above half the population on Cardassia Prime was claimed, and very little outside of that.
The Capital and several major cities were destroyed, and millions of civilians on Cardassia died. I doubt much if any damage was done on the other Cardassian worlds and, as I said, I highly doubt that the Genocide killed as many as you claim. Do you really thing an overstretched Army and a Navy that could spare NO ONE due to the battle above, could wipe out EVERYONE on Cardassia Prime in 3 - 4 hours?
I'd wager that just above half the population on Cardassia Prime was claimed, and very little outside of that.
posted on June 21st, 2010, 11:11 pm
Since they used orbital bombardment that was capable of erasing an entire city in a very short time, simiar methods should work on the other planets in the same system. Since the Dlominion specifically withdrew back to Cardassia Prime, having the hundreds of millions of dead limited to the homeworld, is the most likely though.
However, they did have some time between the order being given and the enemy arriving...
However, they did have some time between the order being given and the enemy arriving...
posted on June 22nd, 2010, 7:10 am
Well, if we take TOS seriously, a Constitution-class starship's phasers could exterminate all life on a whole continent in a single volley.
This means that lacking planetary shielding (or the dommies having the frequencies of said shields) it's entirely possible that Cardassia Prime is a glassball.
Lob a few torps specifically tuned to ignite the atmosphere of the world and it's even easier to do. It's a tactic that nobody except *maybe* the Tholians and the Dominion would be willing to use, however. Well, maybe the Romulans, if backed into a corner.
This means that lacking planetary shielding (or the dommies having the frequencies of said shields) it's entirely possible that Cardassia Prime is a glassball.
Lob a few torps specifically tuned to ignite the atmosphere of the world and it's even easier to do. It's a tactic that nobody except *maybe* the Tholians and the Dominion would be willing to use, however. Well, maybe the Romulans, if backed into a corner.
posted on June 22nd, 2010, 12:15 pm
Gorgo Primus wrote:I highly doubt that the genocide on Cardassia was anywhere close to 'there are no Cardassians left alive there'. Also keep in mind that the Dominion only had a few short hours to do this in as they JUST got long range commucations back after the Cardassian Fleet switched sides.
The Capital and several major cities were destroyed, and millions of civilians on Cardassia died. I doubt much if any damage was done on the other Cardassian worlds and, as I said, I highly doubt that the Genocide killed as many as you claim. Do you really thing an overstretched Army and a Navy that could spare NO ONE due to the battle above, could wipe out EVERYONE on Cardassia Prime in 3 - 4 hours?
I'd wager that just above half the population on Cardassia Prime was claimed, and very little outside of that.
i'm gonna quote myself, because i dont see the point of typing it out again for people who dont read my posts.
myleswolfers wrote:actually, they had numerous weapons platforms and probably several ships in orbit of cardassia prime, and we saw in DS9: The Die is Cast that it doesnt take that many ships to kill any life on a planet...
watch that episode, you will see that a small fleet of ships was able to completely destroy the surface of a planet in 1 volley. thats in seconds, with a rather small fleet, no turrets or space stations in orbit, just a few ships.
we saw in the last episode that the dominion had under their control a large network of orbital defence platforms, which were quite well armed, stripping the shields and hull of the galaxy class USS Galaxy quite fast, in the first battle of chintoka. the dominion easily possessed the firepower to kill all life on cardassia prime in minutes. which appears to be what they did, the founder ordered ALL cardassians killed, weyoun didnt like the idea so he said it would take a while (hoping the founder would recind the order) but she didnt.
the question is whether the cardassians on other worlds were made dead as well, which i believe they were not. maybe small groups of jemhadar left on those planets killed some, but not all.
posted on June 22nd, 2010, 2:27 pm
silent93 wrote:Well, if we take TOS seriously, a Constitution-class starship's phasers could exterminate all life on a whole continent in a single volley.
myleswolfers wrote:watch that episode, you will see that a small fleet of ships was able to completely destroy the surface of a planet in 1 volley. thats in seconds, with a rather small fleet, no turrets or space stations in orbit, just a few ships.
If one takes a look at other sources, like the build of a torpedo (e.g. the 1,5kg antimatter photon torpedoes or the 8 times stronger quantum torpedos), you can see that the effect of a torped is equal to up to 10 times stronger than a common atomic bomb (A volley of such does not suffice to exterminate all life on a continent). If its somewhere (here in TOS) different we have a contradiction, renders both statements invalid for direct argumentation via canon. Instead we should assume torpedoe's effect from their averaged seen consequences which rather support the impression of having a photon torpedo having a yield of 1 to 100 MT TNT-equivalent.
Nevertheless, as the dminion had quite a bunch of ships in orbit around cardassia prime, it is most likely that the whole population of cardassia prime is exterminated.
But if you take a look at the last scene where martok offers the blood wine theres quite much left of cardassia - sure, everything ins broken, fire everywhere - but the surfave is not turned to glass, no athmosphere burning or even heated nor even polluted. The strike seems quite "harmless" for nuclear devastation. To be honest, the view of the burning city on cardassia leaves much mor hope for survivors that a picture of hieroshima. The stable cardassian buildings may have saved many people under them. I doubt that it is much worse on other cardassian planets.
Hence I believe that there's not only the cardassian fleet left, but also a huge number of homless cardassian survivers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRYOsB-I7ik&feature=related
silent93 wrote:Lob a few torps specifically tuned to ignite the atmosphere of the world and it's even easier to do. It's a tactic that nobody except *maybe* the Tholians and the Dominion would be willing to use, however. Well, maybe the Romulans, if backed into a corner.
One can't ignite a athmosphere with a torpedo from all what is known about the torpedos. If it said somewhere it could do so, there was an contradiction in canon, which again renders both statements invalid for argumentation via canon. In that case i'd stay to a realistic estimation, which is that ignation is impossible as the density of any breathable atmosphere is too low for nuclear ignition.
posted on June 22nd, 2010, 2:45 pm
ill say this then
star trek bridge commander
its post dominion war game and the cardies are in force and if u follow the story ull see they have alot of stuff
star trek bridge commander
its post dominion war game and the cardies are in force and if u follow the story ull see they have alot of stuff
posted on June 22nd, 2010, 2:51 pm
The Cardassians there don't have that much, and what they do have would easily fall into what we know survived the war. All they have that doesn't fit is what they got from the (brief) alliance with the Kessok.
A rather small group, overall.
A rather small group, overall.
posted on June 22nd, 2010, 5:33 pm
something i would also like to know is: what happened to the breen ?
posted on June 22nd, 2010, 5:59 pm
they went back to their own space and become even more xenophobic and isolationist.
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