There Can Only Be One Hyper Arty!

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 12:18 am

You're right I should have spammed Tavaras.  :rolleyes:

You can count me in too!
No you can't handle hyperspace artys just fine. I refuse to believe that. Star and I, together, in the same game could barely beat it, and we had to use Bortas. I kept my rheinns and spectres always moving, and still lost 2/3 of my fleet every time HSA went off. And then in another 2 minutes, it happens again.
   The Hyperpspace artillery can also kill miners without ever having to get near to an enemies base. I don't see how anyone could think that its balanced especially for its cheap cost.

Try D'Deridex, try Norexan, try Rhienn. Try something with a good defense or great speed. If you're spamming a lower defense (and not fast enuff to escape) ship, you deserve to get HSAed to death for doing the totally wrong thing against it. Spectres are only 90 speed, if you are trying small units against HSA, get fast ones like Rhienns or something.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 12:33 am

Lol Neb ....

  Just ...



1 HSA will 1-shot kill Rhienns.

2 HSA will 1-shot kill any of those things you just listed.


  So that's that for Rommies ....


Any other pointlessly arbitrary and misguided things to add?

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 12:39 am

Move your Rhienns, they can't be oneshotted if they're out of the blast area. Or refit the Rhienns so they can take some damage. I also have some doubts that Norexan will be oneshotted, maybe while cloaked, but then you can decloak to get shields up. Don't worry about engaging a fleet when you decloak to help with HSA damage, as HSA does friendly fire, so unless a fleet is waiting ahead of you, you can just fly on uncloaked for a bit.
If all that fails (or probably just do this first actually), decloak on HSA and kill it before it fires.

If those counters are prevented by lag, that IS NOT THE FAULT OF THE HSA.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 12:43 am

Great Neb, you've just showed us how we can stop being the retards that we are as Romulans.

  Now ... enlighten us on your Leet tactics with the other races.  Because everything you've said about the Romulans is a perfect reason NOT to limit HSA's to just one.

[Elim]

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 1:47 am

Last edited by Elim on October 23rd, 2010, 2:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

Hmmm, well nobody will give shit about my opinion ("as the scourge of the space ways")  , BUT teching to arty is very risky, and yeah, its so "glorious" and "clever" to spam small ships(kbeq, kvort, rhienn, intrepid etc. ) like no tomorrow and devastate everything with them... yeah very creative....   I think the artillery is meant for counter rushers/spammers who fail to win the game in the first 12-15 minutes, but I would be happy if the artillery would be more effective aginst buildings, and not aginst ships.

And one more thing: just nerf dominion to hell, then even I will give up playing them online

Probably the fith mod to my post (I'm pretty drunk  ) : Nebula has 666 posts!!! Thats evil!

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 2:25 am

Elim, scourge of the spaceways should by your new forum title.

I really like the idea of engines being knocked out for 10 seconds, with it doing a lot less damage to ships, but doing more damage to buildings.  I feel that it's meant to be an offensive unit, but I usually just have them sit in my base as super defenders while my fleet goes to attack.  Any harassment force that heads my way won't survive very long against two of them.  So I would argue that they're not quite being used the way they're intended.

I don't mind if puretech is reduced to only one, just give that new dominion ship we're supposed to get a cool bonus as puretech, and I'll be fine.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 2:32 am

I think the whole point of HSA is to slaughter masses of small units, making them do near-equal to ships and stations just doesn't fit their role. HSA is for when that Fed spams Monsoons (Bugs may be said to be the counter, but they are slower than Monsoons and will likely never escape battles with their lives while Monsoons micro away), or that Klingon spams K'vorts, or any small size spam that you'd have trouble dealing with otherwise.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 3:18 am

Ok Neb, not only do you suggest to build small fast rheinns, but then you say the whole point of the arty is to kill small fast ships...  And there is no counter to hyperspace. I mean the bigger the ship, the slower it is, the more damaged it gets in the AoE. Against small, fast ships, the AoE is so wide that it will incinerate at least 1/3 of your ships.

Don't worry about engaging a fleet when you decloak to help with HSA damage, as HSA does friendly fire, so unless a fleet is waiting ahead of you, you can just fly on uncloaked for a bit.
If all that fails (or probably just do this first actually), decloak on HSA and kill it before it fires.

What about a huge fleet of Federation, Dominion, and Klingon ships all protecting the blasted thing. I'm talking about an invasion from a huge enemy fleet, accompanied by 2 artys. Most of our fleet gathers in one spot to defend, but before the battle even starts, the enemy arty has already destroyed most of our fleet only having to spend 600 di and 300 tri. Now you tell me, is that balanced?

If those counters are prevented by lag, that IS NOT THE FAULT OF THE HSA.

Thanks for reminding me... The AoE is so huge already that its hard enough in a perfect, lag free game. Then you add lag, and then its just game over.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 3:51 am

If you're going to go small ships, go for the fast ones (I'm pretty sure that I just paraphrased myself here.) Still not recommended if you have too many smalls, which will cause a lot of them to die (mix your fleet!) Less small ships, and fast ones, can lead to microing enuff of them away, or only losing a few.
I'm not certain how fast a 100 speed vessel can get out of the AoE, but I'm fairly certain it can at least get to the edge and live to fight later. You can't fit a whole lot of large units in the blast area either, I'm sure you won't lose a third of your fleet if you're on top of your micro.
AoE isn't that big, and it gives you a freaking countdown. One important thing I think you might be forgetting is to not turn around to get out of AoE if your ships are already inside it, have them keep going forward or go to the sides. Turn around if you haven't entered the AoE yet. A 120 speed ship should get out of that circle pretty fast. A large 100 speed should survive.

Don't forget that you have a Borg ally with three pyramids and five Cubes. Also, you have 2 hyper-arties of your own that then annihilate them, as well as three fully-upgraded Perimeters surrounded by Dodec Relays and assimilated Klingon vessels. You win the 3v2!
Isn't making up scenarios that shouldn't happen (attack the HSA while it builds, it takes 203 seconds and you only need to kill one damn constructor. If their fleet guards the constructor try to draw them out or just plain destroy a less protected area) fun?

Again, don't talk about lag balancing. All balancing must assume no noticeable lag. Unless you want to say everything that requires any micro to beat is OP.
We all know how OP Sus'a are because they can decloak and do lots of damage while the lag prevents you from attacking before they kill half your fleet, right?

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 12:36 pm

2 HSA will 1-shot kill any of those things you just listed.


So that's that for Rommies ....


Any other pointlessly arbitrary and misguided things to add?

double hsa doesnt kill a spectre. this is a spectre, without engines, sitting still (obviously) in the centre (the spec was targetted by the hsa) of the blast. it survives. obviously double hsa cant kill anything from the warbird yard in 1 shot.

you should have done your homework on that one boggz.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 1:41 pm

I think that the price for HSA should be increased and that their should be a cost associated with firing its weapon.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 1:47 pm

I think that the price for HSA should be increased and that their should be a cost associated with firing its weapon.

that's interesting. the shells could cost something, seeing as they are probably high tech. i think the devs would say that it comes under the purchase cost, mainly supply. i think it's reasonable that it only starts with limited ammo and u have to buy more.

maybe the first 5 shots are free as they came with the ship. but then the weapon costs a fixed amount per usage. to represent buying new shells.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 3:11 pm

You guys don't get the point. I had upgraded rheinns that were constantly moving with excellent micro. Yes, I know not to go backwards, but you also forget that those who actually know how to use artys target in front of your fleet. 

And Myles, I didn't do the homework, I did the fieldwork. My Spectres were constantly moving and I still lost 4 of them. Not to mention the fact that most had lost shields and had taken severe hull damage. When you say that most will be able to fight later, that doesn't help me. We need our fleets to DEFEND from a massive buildup of enemy ships.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 3:20 pm

And Bortas is OP too because it means you can't defend from a massive buildup. And the pink beam of death is too, because it can kill your ships and then you can't defend. And don't forget about Veqlaraghs that can hold you in place long enuff for the main fleet to kill your ships that are needed for defense.
And especially don't forget about how when you spam a ship that is basically perfectly countered by something, then that something kills your ships because they are damaged already, that means the unit that countered is OP.

posted on October 23rd, 2010, 3:25 pm

And Myles, I didn't do the homework, I did the fieldwork. My Spectres were constantly moving and I still lost 4 of them. Not to mention the fact that most had lost shields and had taken severe hull damage. When you say that most will be able to fight later, that doesn't help me. We need our fleets to DEFEND from a massive buildup of enemy ships.

they must have been already damaged. i tested this today. a double hsa targetted directly at a stationary spectre leaves it with about 10% hull.