Sovereign Class - Durability Issues

posted on March 9th, 2009, 8:55 am

no i belive you are mistaken, i know the people you speak of, but i wasnt part of that, all i said, was it might have a SLIGHT increase, from the xtra torpedo launcher on the battle bridge, and because there were  two targets, it would decrease the damage that one of them would take, as one of them would be badly damaged or destoyed, the other would keep on kicking

yes, they do

posted on March 9th, 2009, 9:59 am

Well if I mistaken you for someone else then I apologize. Im too lazy to go searching for that thread so Im gonna take your word on it

posted on March 9th, 2009, 4:59 pm

okay, thanks,

main point tho, and i think that i speak for everyone, and alsmot all on this post, and in fleet ops would agree, the sovies values need to be increased, as do some other for the feds, and the feds need to be looked at, as do the kligon, and dominion a bit

posted on March 9th, 2009, 5:13 pm

well i think the sov could use a little tweaking it is not what i would like to see the team focusing on. i mean a slightly useless ship pales in comparison to the work the the klingons need done to them (IMO).

posted on March 9th, 2009, 5:40 pm

either way tho, kligons and feds need the biggest work on them, klingons tho need more then feds probably tho

posted on March 9th, 2009, 5:46 pm

yeah, the sov should defiantly out gun a defiant, a defiant is basically, the most weapons in a small package, the sov can take more hits, and dish out more hits, it has a better power system, and also the defiant is pron t4o problems with everything so cloxe togehter,

I would have to disagree with you in terms of firepower. Yes, the Sovereign needs to be stronger defensively - the very reason I started this thread. But the Defiant is probably one of the few Federation starships that is designed with combat as it's sole role. I mean, you don't get the idea that Defiants would be used for science missions or exploring in the same way a Sovereign or Galaxy would be. The Sovereign, while the most capable frontline Federation starships at the time of Nemesis (FO being later in the timeline - this may no longer be the case, i dunno) it isn't a pure combat ship in the same league as the Defiant.

I think the special weapon of the Sovereign is a good reflection of this (e.g. it isn't as combat orientated as the Nevagh or Norexan's special abilities - in that it disables the target rather than obliterating it.) The Defiant being the ace-cube-killer, the Critical Shot ability and good firepower fits the ship's role perfectly.

By the way guys, good comments in the thread so far.

[Megaman3321]

posted on March 9th, 2009, 7:06 pm

Last edited by Megaman3321 on March 9th, 2009, 7:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Sovs are great for taking fleets of pseudo-fighters (scouts) and destroyers. The Engine Overload causes major damage to fast vessels.  10 Sovs vs. 32 scouts and 16 destroyers, no brainer, sort of (especially if they're cloaked!).

posted on March 9th, 2009, 9:07 pm

I would have to disagree with you in terms of firepower. Yes, the Sovereign needs to be stronger defensively - the very reason I started this thread. But the Defiant is probably one of the few Federation starships that is designed with combat as it's sole role. I mean, you don't get the idea that Defiants would be used for science missions or exploring in the same way a Sovereign or Galaxy would be. The Sovereign, while the most capable frontline Federation starships at the time of Nemesis (FO being later in the timeline - this may no longer be the case, i dunno) it isn't a pure combat ship in the same league as the Defiant.

I think the special weapon of the Sovereign is a good reflection of this (e.g. it isn't as combat orientated as the Nevagh or Norexan's special abilities - in that it disables the target rather than obliterating it.) The Defiant being the ace-cube-killer, the Critical Shot ability and good firepower fits the ship's role perfectly.

By the way guys, good comments in the thread so far.

While the Sovereign is not purely combat oriented, it outclasses the Defiant in any means besides maneveurability. It posesses much more weaponary, has considerable stronger shields and is nearly 6 times as large. While size alone says few about the power of a ship, the Defiant is limited because of its size. You cannot fit a large warp core or tons of weapons on it.

The Defiant is a very powerful ships for its size, but the Sovereign is even more advanced in technology than it. And unlike the Galaxy, the Sovereign was designed with the intention of a powerful ship for defense. The Galaxy was more the "build the most modern and comfortable starship and give it enough weaponary to defend itself".

posted on March 9th, 2009, 9:10 pm

ahem.... give the galaxy some respect, it was also built to be the flagship of the fleet,

i totally agree about the sovie, latest technology was put into the soverign, best weaponry, best people, best ship, and im sure a sovy, could best two defiants

[Actium]

posted on March 10th, 2009, 4:43 am

Last edited by Actium on March 10th, 2009, 4:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

mhm
i think the defiant is good as it is, maybe not realistic but balanced and thats the most important thing
also i might note here: the federation itself is very strong in any times of  the game so no need to think u dont have a chance as fed player just because 1 ship isnt so good.

posted on March 10th, 2009, 9:54 pm

the federation itself is very strong in any times of  the game so no need to think u dont have a chance as fed player just because 1 ship isnt so good.

The problem is not one weak ships, but the lack of alternatives for it. Federation lacks late game firepower and defense strenght. Boosting the Sovereign will reduce this problem. I realize you can win with Federation. It is not that unbalanced. But it is more difficult and more expensive compared to other races.

The Defiant has impressive firepower, but it lacks the defense to be the spearhead of your armada. Feds have many great medium sized ships, but no ship to "punch through the line". The center of the line, the power house.

The Romulan Tavara is an extreme example of that. A single Tavara is no match for any med sized Fed fleet. However, mixed with a fleet of other romulan ships it will moop the floor with you. Not to mention 2 of them with support....

posted on March 10th, 2009, 10:31 pm

Ares IV i completely totally agree with you, they dont have a ship that can break through, they have some good midgame ships, and bascially thats the excelsior, and akira,(i always use excelsior) but i think they could use another midgame, and then boost the defiant a bit up, to help the sovy in late game

as far as punching through the line, i find miranda 2s work the best, high defense, and they have the blockade run special ability, and are a very durable ship, howeer not a great amount of fire power,

I feel, they should be added to feds for no credit cost, itd make a great, mide game ship, the miranda could be added for both admirals, or just mayson, as mayson is more defense oriented, he has tje turrent upgrade, and another support ship, and risner gets the phalanx and avalon, so why not even it out by adding the miranda, as far as the empty space in the mixed tech yard, you can make it and upgraded offensive miranad, or somthing like that

back to the late game however, hes completey right, they dont have that iron fist needed to punch through, they have, just alot of ships, and alot of times with feds, it make it so that its just water running off a rock, they dont have that power needed to get through, thell take out a bit of the rock, but it stays strong,

the defiant is good, because of its weapon ability, (which needs to be autofired indivudually be each ship in my opinion), is a nice ship to break through, has good wapon, but its not enoguh!

same with sovy, defense isa okay, but attack not enough,

the phalanx is a sorry excuse, and you can only get it with one admiral, which isnt enough

so what do we turn to, now when i first played 3.0 i was able to get about 5 descents a game, and i thought, yes heres the flagship of any fleet, but in all actuality, no, its not, while its defense is high, and it can stand up to alot, its weapon is below a sovy, and it can do much

so heres my ideas

moce the sovy up, defense goes up to 50 at least, and move the ofense to 45, at least, while i stil feel this might be low, i think it would solve alsmot everything

now, this leaves the a smal gap betwen, the defiant and the sovy

move the defiant up, attack to 40-42, defense, anywhere from 35-38,

now, this is fine, as is right now, the excelsior 2 almost has same stats as defiant, so now that the defiant is move, its fine,

now add in the miranda 2 with either one admiral or both, and it works great

as far as risner, with phalanx, and avalon,

avalon is fine, its special ability is what matters,

phalanx, make you only able to get 4-6 instead of 8, atack 50-60, defense 52-62

and that, would solve the problem in my opinion

posted on March 10th, 2009, 10:43 pm

wow. that's a lot of ideas... in yet another thread. lol 

jk 

posted on March 10th, 2009, 11:08 pm

and whats that supposed to mean, thats what this thread is about, and i have partially stated some ideas about miranda, but i took some time to think this all out, about how to balance out the moving of the sovy up, and the fatc is defiant can be moved up to, cus right now its about equal with the exelsior

posted on March 11th, 2009, 2:02 am

What about decreasing the attack power of all Fed ships and increasing their defense to compensate  . Essentially a Tank race: where weapons are kinda sucky, but try to frickin' kill that vessel, and you'll have a real tough time.