Fed Borg and current balance in 3.2.5

posted on September 1st, 2011, 11:33 pm

Klingon = Lawful neutral.

Ridiculous!  Klingons are Chaotic neutral!

posted on September 1st, 2011, 11:43 pm

Not always, sometimes villains win. Even in Star Trek.

and by villains you mean the afor mentioned races and not the script writers?

posted on September 2nd, 2011, 12:36 am

Them too.

posted on September 2nd, 2011, 1:26 am

Ridiculous!  Klingons are Chaotic neutral!

In TOS/TMP, they are indeed Chaotic Neutral, but in TNG/DS9 they got a strict code of honor that puts them firmly in the Lawful category.

[Tryptic]

posted on September 6th, 2011, 9:43 pm

Last edited by Tryptic on September 6th, 2011, 9:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.

In TOS/TMP, they are indeed Chaotic Neutral, but in TNG/DS9 they got a strict code of honor that puts them firmly in the Lawful category.

Bah, the honor code was half-assed.  I was into Battletech before I discovered Star Trek, and I got through the entire series without realizing they were supposed to care about honor.  After the Clans' honor code, the Klingons' looks like a joke because it's just never developed properly.

Clan Honor code: Any personal dispute, military promotion, criminal court or even major battle can be resolved through a trial of combat, usually 1v1.

Klingon Honor code: Don't disobey the Emperor (unless you can get away with it), Avenge your family members if they get killed, and if somebody insults you you can kill them.

Maybe there's more to it in the books, but in the shows a Klingon will abandon his honor at the drop of a hat.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 9:55 pm

That's because there wasn't one. No matter how much they talk about 'honor', only Worf ever showed much interest in it. The regular TNG Klingons were just modern day Humans with less cowardice and not as money obsessed.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:20 pm

there was a bit more to klingon honour in canon.

the solution of problems via combat was there. if you challenged a superior the answer was always someone had to die. if you called someone a liar combat was again the way to settle it.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:30 pm

That was cowardice or dishonorable conduct that caused death, challenging their authority simply lead to a beating for the weaker of the two.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:33 pm

That was cowardice or dishonorable conduct that caused death, challenging their authority simply lead to a beating for the weaker of the two.

thats still challenging them to their position. regardless of why the challenge was made.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:38 pm

The reason is important because it determines how the challenge ends, they don't kill the loser every time. It was your statement they always kill that I was opposing.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:41 pm

The reason is important because it determines how the challenge ends, they don't kill the loser every time. It was your statement they always kill that I was opposing.

i dont ever remember a challenge resulting in just a fight. i always remember it being a fight to the death.

also to clarify, by challenge, i meant a direct challenge where you made it clear it was a challenge, not just being rude and indirectly challenging.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:46 pm

Klingons will challenge officers they don't respect to combat, the one that challenged Riker didn't do it indirectly; it was a direct challenge in front of the bridge crew.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:50 pm

Klingons will challenge officers they don't respect to combat, the one that challenged Riker didn't do it indirectly; it was a direct challenge in front of the bridge crew.

good point, that was a direct challenge. if riker had been a klingon he would have likely killed that guy. but he offered him to retract his challenge, and the guy did.

[Tyler]

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:56 pm

Last edited by Tyler on September 6th, 2011, 10:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Some possibly do die, though the other Klingons didn't seem too surprised or disapointed that the loser lived and treated him no worse. The dead ones are probably those that didn't know when to quit or accept defeat like a man, since it didn't seem to be a requirement of defeat.

posted on September 6th, 2011, 10:58 pm

Possibly, though the other Klingons didn't seem too surprised or disapointed that the loser lived and treated him no worse. Even if some didn't know when to quit or accept defeat, it didn't seem to be a requirement of defeat.

maybe they accepted the non lethal outcome cos riker wasnt klingon.