TNG

posted on December 28th, 2009, 7:28 pm

• Klingon-Cardassian War: 2372 – 2373
• Federation-Klingon War (2372-73): 2372 – 2373

Long before? Memory Alpha has a different view on that one...

posted on December 28th, 2009, 7:30 pm

klingons retreated from cardy space in early season 4, the klingons attacked the feds later that season, not as long as i originally said, but still after. theres no way the klingons could have the majority of their fleet attacking two enemies. they beat the cardys, rightly declared victory and left. then attacked the feds.

posted on December 28th, 2009, 7:34 pm

Memory Alpha again:

The Dominion was able to all but obliterate the Obsidian Order and severely weaken the Tal Shiar (see: Battle of the Omarion Nebula), nearly cause a war between the Federation and the Tzenkethi, and later to succeed in causing a conflict between the Federation and the Klingons (see Federation-Klingon War (2372-73)), while concurrently causing a conflict between the Klingons and the Cardassians (see Klingon-Cardassian War).

Concurrently means Happening at the same time as something else. Memory Alpha still doesn't agree with 'one war happened, then a second happened afterwards'.

posted on December 28th, 2009, 7:36 pm

memory alpha is assuming there that the kling-cardy war continued after gowron declared victory. i disagree with that opinion. i believe the war ended there, but the klingons kept some cardy territory and launched raids against cardys. they didnt continue a war though, that is my opinion though, and all are welcome to disagree 

posted on December 28th, 2009, 7:47 pm

Sisko saved the Detapa council, causing the Klingons to attack DS9, causing the war with the Federation. When the Dominion later came through the Wormhole and Sisko offered Gowron the Khitomer accords, he said their fleet would halt their advance into Cardassian territory.

That implies they were still at war and some fleets hadn't encountered the Dominion yet, because you can't halt an advance that has already ended or been destroyed by the Dominion.

You believe they didn't, I believe they did... even Memory Alpha doesn't seem to help us agree...

posted on December 28th, 2009, 7:49 pm

the evidence of gowron retreating twice is confusing indeed.
he retreated after the way of the warrior and claimed victory, he then retreated again when the dominion came through, is he french? monsieur gowron?

i prefer to think that the second retreat was all of his raiders and not an actual klingon fleet.

posted on December 28th, 2009, 7:55 pm

If they didn't continue the war, the raiders were probably a fleet left behind to keep the Cardassians busy while the main forces attacked Starfleet. Can't be doing with the enemy rebuilding while you're focused on someone else.

posted on December 28th, 2009, 8:02 pm

i can believe that, gowron left behind around a hundred ships to annoy the cardys, while the rest of the fleet tried to molest starfleet.  both failed 

posted on December 28th, 2009, 8:08 pm

Yeah... wouldn't mean that the war had finished, but at the same time was technically still happening?

i can believe that, gowron left behind around a hundred ships to annoy the cardys, while the rest of the fleet tried to molest starfleet.  both failed 

The sort of failure only the Romulans from Enterprise can match... causing the Federation to be made by trying to destroy the early alliance...

posted on December 28th, 2009, 8:12 pm

i prefer to think the war was over, but hostilities continued, like the feds and dominion fought for months at the cardy/dom border before the minefield incident and the second battle of ds9 triggered the dominion war.

the romulans were amazingly incompetent. they were much stronger than earth starfleet, according to tos they had a war with earth before the federations official formation in 2161, maybe the other species (andorian vulcan etc) helped earth withstand the romulan attack. because i cant guess how earth alone could stop romulans.

EDIT: also the borg caused first contact by trying to stop it
EDIT2: and jjabrams castrated trek by trying to save it

posted on December 28th, 2009, 8:19 pm

i prefer to think the war was over, but hostilities continued, like the feds and dominion fought for months at the cardy/dom border before the minefield incident and the second battle of ds9 triggered the dominion war.

Cold War conditions?

the romulans were amazingly incompetent. they were much stronger than earth starfleet, according to tos they had a war with earth before the federations official formation in 2161, maybe the other species (andorian vulcan etc) helped earth withstand the romulan attack. because i cant guess how earth alone could stop romulans.

Pre-Federation was the 'Coalition of Planets', so it was most likely the alliance between at least the 4 races (maybe a few more who joined by that time).

EDIT: also the borg caused first contact by trying to stop it
EDIT2: and jjabrams castrated trek by trying to save it

I'd say that even the best have their off-days, but it's truly astounding the Borg made such a mistake...

posted on December 28th, 2009, 8:22 pm

yh cold war sounds about right

i'd be willing to bet the andorians and vulcans did help, which would probably be enough to stop the romulans

and the borg suffered major villain decay, i mean look at voyager and a sphere p**sing off a tac cube so much it self destructed. and then endgame poor borgies. definitely not swedish, but not much more intimidating.

posted on December 28th, 2009, 8:28 pm

We finally came to an agreement of the Klingon-Cardassian conflict that works for both sides.

As for the Borgs 'Villain decay', that was pretty much unavoidable once they decided to make a series set in the Delta Quadrent. A ship literally in their backyard is bound to meet them often, so the number of creative ideas for Borg storylines will run down fast and leave little left to use in the movies.

posted on December 28th, 2009, 8:31 pm

We finally came to an agreement of the Klingon-Cardassian conflict that works for both sides.

if only the klingons and cardys were as agreeable as us, there would have been no war/not war/cold war/hoedown between them 

i really had hoped there would be a mention in nemesis about the fate of the borg, we are all left wondering if our favourite cybernetic race are still ready to contribute to contrived plots for more trek movies/shows

posted on December 29th, 2009, 5:55 pm

Seeing as how Voyager also killed the Borg Queen (twice  ), I'd bet she comes back again.  Unfortunately with transphasic torps in reserve for that final Borg meeting, I don't think we're going to see the Borg again unless JJ Abrams decides to further their villain decay while finishing the painful assassination of TOS Star Trek.