Galaxy class waste or not?

posted on July 26th, 2011, 2:55 pm

this comes down to whether we think a dread would be useful for starfleet. i would say not, if war was coming i would expect them to make many more defiant classes to fill out the fleet. low crew, high power.

a dread always seemed purely psychological to me. and stafleet seems too rational to waste ~1000 crew on something that isnt really helpful.

True, but unfortunately rational went out the window with the Galaxy class, I mean who the hell puts whole families on starships?

posted on July 26th, 2011, 2:57 pm

True, but unfortunately rational went out the window with the Galaxy class, I mean who the hell puts whole families on starships?

yeah that was silly. i guess they could explain it by saying the only recent wars starfleet had werent very important, so they got complacent. seemed like the kicked the arses of the cardies, and the tzenkethi, and we didnt hear much about the sheliak either. all the "wars" starfleet had seemed like 1 episode mentions. couldnt have scared starfleet ship designers much. so they built something with families

posted on July 26th, 2011, 2:58 pm

Starfleet does, as they have since before the Galaxy Class. Ambassador and Miranda Class have been known to have families. The Galaxy is just the first ship to give them the ability to have a life while onboard.

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:01 pm

Starfleet does, as they have since before the Galaxy Class. Ambassador and Miranda Class have been known to have families. The Galaxy is just the first ship to give them the ability to have a life while onboard.

the numbers were different though. the galaxy had 1000 dudes on board but less than half were actual crew. so thats a lot of family. i doubt mirandas had more than a dozen civilians on board. it seemed like they kinda shoehorned sisko's gal into the wolf 359 thing just to give him something to be angry at picard/life about.

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:03 pm

I still don't see where the 'less than half' comes from... I don't recall any mention of the division outside of fanon, only that most people seen on the show wore a Starfleet uniform.

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:04 pm

You see the Excalibur reminds me of the galaxy class. It seems it's sole purpose is longterm exploration with families of the crew onboard. Large vessels = long term sustainability. I wouldn't expect her to be armed to the teeth but capable in a fight.

An interesting take would be use the Excalibur as a fed / Borg mixed tech vessel, with transwarp or a transwarp conduit special - like p81's dauntless.

[Equinox1701e]

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:05 pm

Last edited by Equinox1701e on July 26th, 2011, 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Starfleet does, as they have since before the Galaxy Class. Ambassador and Miranda Class have been known to have families. The Galaxy is just the first ship to give them the ability to have a life while onboard.

Yes they do hence my point, WTF were they thinking. I could see MAYBE with ships that hang out in the core systems in the federation doing your menial tasks, but a large explorer going into the unknown and or into (many) crisis situations such as cheaking up on the Romulans, slowing down the invading borg cube, getting involved in Klingon politics, ect. Just a foolish idea, starfleet would have been better off only posting officers and crew on a Galaxy that had NO immediate family they would bring along.

And on a side note, who leaves their family on the ship when its heading to engage a borg cube anyway? I mean sure you may not have had time to drop them off, then let them take a couple shuttles to get off the ship or even have 1 ship take all the family crew members back to a safe location.

[Tyler]

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:07 pm

Last edited by Tyler on July 26th, 2011, 3:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Galaxy Class weren't supposed to go into battle with families; that was what Saucer Seperation was intended for. It would have happened a lot more often in the show, if not for budget reasons I heard.

On a side note: Did you know the Excelsior is capable of seperation?

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:13 pm

Galaxy Class weren't supposed to go into battle with families; that was what Saucer Seperation was intended for. It would have happened a lot more often in the show, if not for budget reasons I heard.

The only problem with that theory is this, if your exploring unknown space (which is what the Galaxy was designed for) and you are attacked, your likely not gonna have the time to do a separation, and even if you did, what happens if the stardrive section loses? The saucer aint outrunning any enemy combat ship at impulse, and they sure arnt gonna outfight it, now they have a saucer full of hostages/slaves and some of starfleets newest tech (at the time at least).

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:15 pm

Galaxy Class weren't supposed to go into battle with families; that was what Saucer Seperation was intended for. It would have happened a lot more often in the show, if not for budget reasons I heard.

On a side note: Did you know the Excelsior is capable of seperation?

Oh yeah, I read about the Excelsior separation thing, and so could the connie altho it couldnt reinitgrate the saucer. Dont know how cannon those claims are tho.

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:16 pm

The only problem with that theory is this, if your exploring unknown space (which is what the Galaxy was designed for) and you are attacked, your likely not gonna have the time to do a separation, and even if you did, what happens if the stardrive section loses? The saucer aint outrunning any enemy combat ship at impulse, and they sure arnt gonna outfight it, now they have a saucer full of hostages/slaves and some of starfleets newest tech (at the time at least).

theres that and theres also this:

captain: all civilians, we're about to go explore a new area of space, we dont know if random aliens with forehead ridges will attack us this week, so we're gonna drop all civilians off in the saucer without warp drive in the middle of space, with wesley in charge. have fun, and if we get blowed up, you're on your own.

the ent d was exploring all the damn time, it spent nearly all the time in places where they dont know if civilians will be safe. if they did separate every time they went somewhere new, the ship would spend most of its time cut in half.

saucer sep i think fits better as an emergency thing.

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:22 pm

The saucer getting in bad times like that is no different from the many civilian-owned vessels throughout the Federation in the same position. A seperated Galaxy is still better armed with more security than them. Some of those ship are also known to leave Federation space.

Those civilians were likely made aware of the risk when they chose to go with their Starfleet families.

Oh yeah, I read about the Excelsior separation thing, and so could the connie altho it couldnt reinitgrate the saucer. Dont know how cannon those claims are tho.

I don't think it was ever in canon, though a novel of one of the movies had the Excelsior going through seperation drills.

[Equinox1701e]

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:23 pm

Last edited by Equinox1701e on July 26th, 2011, 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.

theres that and theres also this:

captain: all civilians, we're about to go explore a new area of space, we dont know if random aliens with forehead ridges will attack us this week, so we're gonna drop all civilians off in the saucer without warp drive in the middle of space, with wesley in charge. have fun, and if we get blowed up, you're on your own.

the ent d was exploring all the damn time, it spent nearly all the time in places where they dont know if civilians will be safe. if they did separate every time they went somewhere new, the ship would spend most of its time cut in half.

saucer sep i think fits better as an emergency thing.

True, and even IF the saucer could somehow avoid getting take/destroyed, they are starnded at impulse in deep space with only impuse engines. And with how deep the Galaxy classes explore the nearest ship could be months away, and in worst case the saucer goes through an Ion storm and loses all communications and are a billion years (ok not quite) away from the nearest outpost at impulse. I suppose with any luck the bad guys will leave them alone while they wait to be resuced.

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:26 pm

The saucer getting in bad times like that is no different from the many civilian-owned vessels throughout the Federation in the same position. A seperated Galaxy is still better armed with more security than them. Some of those ship are also known to leave Federation space.

Those civilians were likely made aware of the risk when they chose to go with their Starfleet families.
I don't think it was ever in canon, though a novel of one of the movies had the Excelsior going through seperation drills.

It was in the Return by the Shat man, also true it may be better armed but most civilian ships arnt on the fringe of explored space wating to get jacked by aliens with forehead ridges. 

posted on July 26th, 2011, 3:32 pm

theres that and theres also this:

captain: all civilians, we're about to go explore a new area of space, we dont know if random aliens with forehead ridges will attack us this week, so we're gonna drop all civilians off in the saucer without warp drive in the middle of space, with wesley in charge. have fun, and if we get blowed up, you're on your own.

the ent d was exploring all the damn time, it spent nearly all the time in places where they dont know if civilians will be safe. if they did separate every time they went somewhere new, the ship would spend most of its time cut in half.

saucer sep i think fits better as an emergency thing.

The Galaxy never left Federation-owned space (except for incidents like the one with with Q) and was alway only a few hours from nearby planets. Distress calls wouldn't be easy to miss.

Also, half the time seperated? How many races do you reckon are both hostile and powerful enough to defeat a battleship that was stated in show to get some of the best crews Starfleet has to offer?

also true it may be better armed but most civilian ships arnt on the fringe of explored space wating to get jacked by aliens with forehead ridges. 

They go where they choose, they don't have militant rules. Since most civilian ships seen are freighters, traders and scientists, leaving safe space isn't new. Raven, anyone?

I really wouldn't be surpised if a 'Whatever. Anyone causes trouble and Starfleet will bail me out' mentality is common.