What I would like to see for Fed ship build list/warpin

posted on August 5th, 2010, 5:57 am

How about this, take the Steamrunner from warpin and have it buildable from the antares yard and replace its warpin spot with a normal Miranda(with impulse engines on the pod like in DS9/one phaser and one pulse, fully ranked has one phaser and two pulses).

Also, the Akira is a little low on the build list I believe. Either have it fire two torps from one tube from the start and have it have it have two tubes once fully ranked or two tubes and then two torps each once ranked fully. And have the ?Klingon? mixed tech version either fire the same amount of quantums or a max of two light ion torps per volly.

posted on August 5th, 2010, 6:21 am

Hmm, well hello first! 

  Second, the idea of having the Miranda as a warp-in has been brought up before and the Developers feel that the Miranda is just too old to have actually still in service.  True, it was in DS9 in large numbers along with the Excelsior, but the Miranda is far older than the excelsior and was not the all-around awesome ship that the Excel was .

  They've said that they will include it as a map object and maybe they'll even let it come out and play in various forms.  Heck, with some of the new stuff that might come later, even map makers like myself might be able to add them to maps in cool new ways .

  As for the Akira- you think it's too high in the tech tree?  Honestly I think it's right where it should be.  A good, stiff, medium cruiser that lets the Antares ya produce late-game capable vessels.

posted on August 5th, 2010, 6:47 am

Two torps are for the mixed tech variant. And if one launcher fires two, the damage would be the same, but with more torps. If we would build the ships like they would be equipped in the shows, we would have a laser show eye-cancer (with the same damage like we now have, only more graphics)

Burst-fire launchers may give you a litte more damage in the initial-round, but dont make any difference in longer encounters, because the damage is based on the offensive-value. Fire 4 torps with a damage of 10 or one torp with the damage of 40.

The only thing that counts too, is that burst-fire torps do hit more statistic like. If the "only" torp will miss, it is a missrate of 100% or if it will hit, its a hit-rate of 100%, while the burst-fire ones act more to the table of possibility.
(More shots, more calculations)

And welcome to the forum :-)

posted on August 5th, 2010, 8:08 am

I always thought the Akira should have two torp launchers with a slightly higher offensive capability.  Though, I believe its current stats are helping to keep Feds balanced well.

posted on August 5th, 2010, 11:26 am

How about this, take the Steamrunner from warpin and have it buildable from the antares yard and replace its warpin spot with a normal Miranda(with impulse engines on the pod like in DS9/one phaser and one pulse, fully ranked has one phaser and two pulses).

Also, the Akira is a little low on the build list I believe. Either have it fire two torps from one tube from the start and have it have it have two tubes once fully ranked or two tubes and then two torps each once ranked fully. And have the ?Klingon? mixed tech version either fire the same amount of quantums or a max of two light ion torps per volly.

welcome to the forums, hope to see you online.

about the steamrunner, its a warpin ship and the devs are probably not gonna make it buildable. the steamrunner i believe will soon go into the artillery only warpin button.

about the akira, i think it should swap places and stats with the excel 2, i think its a rather more capable ship than fo gives it credit.

posted on August 5th, 2010, 11:41 pm

Second, the idea of having the Miranda as a warp-in has been brought up before and the Developers feel that the Miranda is just too old to have actually still in service.  True, it was in DS9 in large numbers along with the Excelsior, but the Miranda is far older than the excelsior and was not the all-around awesome ship that the Excel was.

Yeah, that does make sense.

They've said that they will include it as a map object and maybe they'll even let it come out and play in various forms.  Heck, with some of the new stuff that might come later, even map makers like myself might be able to add them to maps in cool new ways.

Im a bit of a mapper myself so this has peaked my interest greatly.

As for the Akira- you think it's too high in the tech tree?  Honestly I think it's right where it should be.  A good, stiff, medium cruiser that lets the Antares ya produce late-game capable vessels.

Not too high, too low.

@Sheva

I did not know that. So, thats how that all works.

about the steamrunner, its a warpin ship and the devs are probably not gonna make it buildable. the steamrunner i believe will soon go into the artillery only warpin button.

Oh ok.

about the akira, i think it should swap places and stats with the excel 2, i think its a rather more capable ship than fo gives it credit.

I agree.

posted on August 6th, 2010, 6:39 am

the steamrunner i believe will soon go into the artillery only warpin button.

Wait!  Whats that?  They are going to split the warp-in so you can specify which types of warp-ins you want?  Oh, i hope not.  I'm happy with the 4 slot descent vs 3 random choice, but to start saying "Send me 3 artillery, stat" seems a little too much.

posted on August 6th, 2010, 8:13 am

If they do it, it'll probably be 'Send me 1 artillery...and I hope I get the one I want'.

posted on August 6th, 2010, 8:47 am

Well, it would be cool to have more than one arty ship for the feds.

I like arty ships, because they increase the tactical range of the game and give you as well a small strategic element. We are all about tactics rights now, with only a little strategy (if you compare it one on one). Arty vessels make it a little better.

So, lets say we have a carrier that is able to send out Danabue-Runabouts that may be equipped with a certain refit. One of these refits (you can install a combat section, an arty section, a sensor-section or a support-section) is the arty refit that is able to fire a refined version of the tricobalt-torp, but in a mini-version. This ship will be very slow, even for a runabout, because the arty-section might get nearly as big as the runabout itself. BUT you might gain the ability to let it dock back at the carrier for repair/ammunition.

I also think, that the actual carrier the feds have should get and the golden bar rank the ability to hold runabouts in a dock. The extended hangar bays only to a very LITTLE increase of combat effectiveness, I think. So let it be a ship thats more worthy to build, so that you have your fighters, dock bays for runabouts and let it launch some kind of "delta flyer" as special ability. So you can send over two or three runabouts (one or two golden bars). 6 fighters and one superior fighter, which abilities will depend on the experience of the carrier (like we have with the placable turrets the klingon ion-special-red-nebula-ship can make. But not a turret, its a shuttle/fighter/whatever).

So the carrier might launch up to 10 small ships, which all have a task to fullfill. The fighters do close combat fight, the runabouts are more the purpose-force (depending on refit) while the "delta flyer" is a special purpose ship that will backbone the carrier. So to say a one-fleet ship.

Up until now, the fed-carrier is pretty boring without any real use. I'd rather build an avalon - because of the less supply costs. It goes without asking, that it must be balanced with costs/time and stats. But the dominion carrier will take down a fed carrier - I think. (didnt made the test)

posted on August 6th, 2010, 10:31 am

Plz dont add more ships to any race...we got plenty of ships right now and they are not properly balanced (but closer than ever before).

posted on August 6th, 2010, 10:47 am

Plz dont add more ships to any race...we got plenty of ships right now and they are not properly balanced (but closer than ever before).

Waaaa!    But I wanna have moreeeee....

While in general I agree with you, i think warp-in is the one area where the devs can allow themselves to go a little crazy.  The concept of warp-in is a distress call to any available ships in the area to come and help out.  So, while starfleet have their current blueprints etc for what they can build, theoretically anything out there still flying could turn up in response.  Theoretically these distress call could be intercepted by hostile forces and you could find yourself not with 2 ambassadors and a steamrunner but 3 Borg Cubes sitting on your doorstep! 

Ok, so the latter would not be nice and could royally screw your game, especially if playing for the fast warp-in at the start.

But, why not allow just about anything to turn up within reason (nothing to OP that would unbalance the game).  For example you could end up with scout ships, destroyers, cruisers, battleships.... all depends.  The more powerful the ship of course the more warp-in slots are taken to balance things out further.

Overall i'm not saying this should happen.  I like the current Warp-in system.  I do wonder though how long it will be before the devs do something about the "experimental" warp-in... much as I love it, its kinda strange and doesn't really fit the concept... perhaps at least a rename to "Appeal to SF command for some kick ass backup Warp-in".

One thing I really love about FO and the devs is that they are willing to try different things out and see how they work in reality and if they don't work then - poof - gone in the next version.  We are all beta testers and happy to be so.

posted on August 6th, 2010, 11:00 am

I like the idea of more ships... 

Well, I must say, I use only a few of them, because those I dont build mosty showed themselves useless. And now there is the work for devs to make those ships useful. You have 2 ways of solving that:
- Change the ship itself
- Add an additional ship that will coorporate with the one you didnt build until now, so that those two together are worth building them.

For example:

You wont build an Excel II against destroyers, but with a souvie and a defiant, this ship get really mighty. With the souvie, you deactivate the enemy propulsion and the defiant will disable the weapons of the ship nearest to the Excel II. Now you activate the ACS-Ability and doom the destroyers to death, while the defiant will take on the other ones and the souvie can go forward for a base attack.

I love those combos - but sadly, I'm bad at micro. So I have the idea for it afterwards my ships got owned

posted on August 6th, 2010, 11:47 am

I like the idea of more ships... 

Well, I must say, I use only a few of them, because those I dont build mosty showed themselves useless. And now there is the work for devs to make those ships useful. You have 2 ways of solving that:
- Change the ship itself
- Add an additional ship that will coorporate with the one you didnt build until now, so that those two together are worth building them.

For example:

You wont build an Excel II against destroyers, but with a souvie and a defiant, this ship get really mighty. With the souvie, you deactivate the enemy propulsion and the defiant will disable the weapons of the ship nearest to the Excel II. Now you activate the ACS-Ability and doom the destroyers to death, while the defiant will take on the other ones and the souvie can go forward for a base attack.

I love those combos - but sadly, I'm bad at micro. So I have the idea for it afterwards my ships got owned

Well, most ships are not designed to work alone, each fills a niche.  I can't say there are many ships that i *never* build.  Sure, i have my preferred ships and tactics, but I wouldn't call any of them useless.  Maybe you just haven't found a use for them yet?

Name a ship which you think is useless and wait for the responses from people telling you how useful they are. 

posted on August 6th, 2010, 11:54 am

i guess the least useful ship is probably the c-11. its main problems are low defence and specials that dont have a lot of effect.

the low defence means that the computer will auto target them, a normal fleet will blow away a c-11 before it can run. its energy giving special can be useful, but its doubtful you will keep it alive for long enough to get use out of it. as to use its special to the best of its abilities it actually has to get in the battle, where the enemy will turn it into debris. if it had a useful special that it could use from behind the lines then i would definitely make them, as u can never have too many useful specials.

its a shame as the high ranked c11 is an amazing tank. a vet c-11 can shrug off hits from an unupgraded fed outpost. its shield regen is stupidly fast.

posted on August 6th, 2010, 12:37 pm

Feds:
Well, I never build a saber for example. Falls too fast, not enough firepower to really destroy a thing.

The monsoon is also a vessel I never build. Only the mixed tech one is sometimes used, if available.

Then there is the supply-vessel, which gives you a second volley of torps. I only use it to gain some supply, but never use the ability, because I need the supply in order to build ships.

I nearly never build the fed-fighter carrier. It costs too much and there is not a massive fleet where it could provide enough distraction for a real counter.

Rommies:
Well, here I must say I nearly use every ship. Pretty well made. Only the small shrike or so may be overjumped.

Klingons:
Where should I start. Well, the B'rel does good in early game, but later it is cannon fodder. I build two of them, max 3, and if one falls, it wont get rebuild. I change directly to the K'Vort.
The Susa falls before it reaches the enemy base to strike with effect. I rather use the Sang-class, then the Susa.

The Qaw’Duj is only used because of its special ability. I dont know what to do with this ship in a mixed encounter instead of letting it fire its special and retreat (if I manage to micro it correctly). But in most cases, I dont even build it. Same goes for the Charg’H. I replace both with the Vor'cha.

I take some Vor'cha with some K'Vorts backboning with a few Sang-classes in one fleet and take the LuSpet Class in combination with a Vutpa’ (or two) into the second fleet. For some special action, I use the Bortas. The Negh'Var is only build, if I play Martok. And as you may see, I'd rather play Martok. But klingons rely on spam, so I have my problems with them.

Dominion:
Well, well. The bug is a rarly seen ship if you play with me. Same goes for the C-11. I like the B-8 and S-2 with one or two bombers that do flanking manouvers in order to destroy mining operations.

I mostly use the breen battleship OR the S-7 defender. But in newer day, I intend to do the breen avatar, because of the cloaking device and the better performance of the S-2 and B-8 while having a nice front-breaking battleship.

Borg: I never build the detector, the probe and the adaptor. sometimes a scout cube and then building assims and spheres for initiating diamond and cubes.

I use two fleets for the borg. One to assimilate the small flies, and one to do devastating damage.

The first fleet, two assims and maybe one or two pyramids with 4 holding beams are there to cause fear and confusion in the middle of the field. They assimilate, capture ships and I send them right back to where the enemy is, so that it cant rest. The second fleet is then build, while the assims do their job and will the overpower the enemy, that isnt able to do any sigificant action to me at this point.

Not to mention, that a dodeca or two are supporting my assim/pyramid-fleet.