Borg needs some Improvements
You feel like a battlecruiser is too weak or a race too strong? Go ahead and discuss it here :)
posted on July 27th, 2010, 7:08 pm
Nevermind about the modifications. What is the build order for the two Borg profiles?
By the way, I can't find any guides, where are they?
By the way, I can't find any guides, where are they?
posted on July 27th, 2010, 7:10 pm
Borg Strategy Guide: http://guide.fleetops.net/guide/strategy/borg
posted on July 27th, 2010, 7:26 pm
I personally suggest that you break any fixation on 'build orders' and flex. All it takes to beat you if you rely on build orders is to figure out what that order is.
However, you will have to spit out that conduction matrix ASAP. Without it, you can't build ships. I also suggest buying your first level connections upgrade ASAP. Beyond that, change and adapt to each game. Unpredictable can be hard to beat.
However, you will have to spit out that conduction matrix ASAP. Without it, you can't build ships. I also suggest buying your first level connections upgrade ASAP. Beyond that, change and adapt to each game. Unpredictable can be hard to beat.
posted on July 27th, 2010, 10:49 pm
hm, well this my opinion, why is borg weak. I played it a lot, its just an opinion. Many of you may disagree. Mostly for opti written but some for both avatars.
1. in team games 3vs3, 4vs4 if you have more than 1 borg you are more likely to loose. i played enough games to notice that. The later the game gets it gets more difficult for borg to win even with tact cubes. This is just from online experience gained. Although nanites are a must have for borg to survive and win the late game.
2. Scubes repair slowly, with regen module only slightly faster, but you must have an adapted photon torp and also emscube for cloak detect so you are unlikely to build a reg scube.
Result: if we have pro players than can micro well and know counters, they will repair the damaged ships, while your scubes take damage and are out of the game for some time. So basicly you can be out of ships cos they are too damaged and have zero loses. Thats the first weak thing. plus scube unit pathing can make it more dificult for micro, in team games especially.
Later you build dodechs which disable random subsystems, if you are lucky to disable engines you can get a sure kill.
3. A romulan scout can stay in borg base the whole game and cant be detected unless there is an emscube being atacked, nanites may do the job, not sure in this version, while for normal cloak you need a deployed dodech. You need to sacrifice a unit.
Result: you know what is borg building all the time, and borg lacks numbers so a deployed unit doesnt help.
4. To get any kind of research you need a 1200 dilith 600 trit building which is expensive for early or early-mid game. although research is free it takes time. Other races can research much earlier the proper counter specials like tricobalt torp etc. When you decide to build it you must have several nodes already deployed to enable construction of ships, cos that building takes a lot of time to build. Thats if you have one borg constructor, which is usually the case.
Result: In early-mid game other races get a slight advantage over borg cos of research although borg modules, give him some help.
5. Sphere is a ship which can take a lot of damage, but baslicly countered with autonomus ai easily, its usually targeted last if there are smaller ships to be destroyed. In 3vs3 can go down quite easily. Again with micromanagment loosing ships can be evaded easily unless borg picks of your retreating units from the back, havent seen that much, even with several loses you can defeat the borg force. Several spheres can do the job, (but im not a big fan of them), cos you cant micromanage then that good. and a sphere can make a physics blok to help other sphere escape. Using sphere specials when researched maybe a downside since you will loose special energy for regeneration.
6. So basicly a combo devastating atack, high energy slicer and nanites can give you sure kills.
Talking about opti of course. But by the time you get those things... And nanites are kind of reduced in this patch, but still powerfull.
7. Its just too vurneable to torpedo units, even with torpedo modules. Last is an opinion. Saw too many times that units even with several torpedo modules get destroyed by torpedo based units like excell 2.
This is written in assumption that we have some top players playing, which can micro well.
1. in team games 3vs3, 4vs4 if you have more than 1 borg you are more likely to loose. i played enough games to notice that. The later the game gets it gets more difficult for borg to win even with tact cubes. This is just from online experience gained. Although nanites are a must have for borg to survive and win the late game.
2. Scubes repair slowly, with regen module only slightly faster, but you must have an adapted photon torp and also emscube for cloak detect so you are unlikely to build a reg scube.
Result: if we have pro players than can micro well and know counters, they will repair the damaged ships, while your scubes take damage and are out of the game for some time. So basicly you can be out of ships cos they are too damaged and have zero loses. Thats the first weak thing. plus scube unit pathing can make it more dificult for micro, in team games especially.
Later you build dodechs which disable random subsystems, if you are lucky to disable engines you can get a sure kill.
3. A romulan scout can stay in borg base the whole game and cant be detected unless there is an emscube being atacked, nanites may do the job, not sure in this version, while for normal cloak you need a deployed dodech. You need to sacrifice a unit.
Result: you know what is borg building all the time, and borg lacks numbers so a deployed unit doesnt help.
4. To get any kind of research you need a 1200 dilith 600 trit building which is expensive for early or early-mid game. although research is free it takes time. Other races can research much earlier the proper counter specials like tricobalt torp etc. When you decide to build it you must have several nodes already deployed to enable construction of ships, cos that building takes a lot of time to build. Thats if you have one borg constructor, which is usually the case.
Result: In early-mid game other races get a slight advantage over borg cos of research although borg modules, give him some help.
5. Sphere is a ship which can take a lot of damage, but baslicly countered with autonomus ai easily, its usually targeted last if there are smaller ships to be destroyed. In 3vs3 can go down quite easily. Again with micromanagment loosing ships can be evaded easily unless borg picks of your retreating units from the back, havent seen that much, even with several loses you can defeat the borg force. Several spheres can do the job, (but im not a big fan of them), cos you cant micromanage then that good. and a sphere can make a physics blok to help other sphere escape. Using sphere specials when researched maybe a downside since you will loose special energy for regeneration.
6. So basicly a combo devastating atack, high energy slicer and nanites can give you sure kills.
Talking about opti of course. But by the time you get those things... And nanites are kind of reduced in this patch, but still powerfull.
7. Its just too vurneable to torpedo units, even with torpedo modules. Last is an opinion. Saw too many times that units even with several torpedo modules get destroyed by torpedo based units like excell 2.
This is written in assumption that we have some top players playing, which can micro well.
posted on July 27th, 2010, 11:10 pm
littletimmy wrote:hm, well this my opinion, why is borg weak. I played it a lot, its just an opinion. Many of you may disagree. Mostly for opti written but some for both avatars.
1. in team games 3vs3, 4vs4 if you have more than 1 borg you are more likely to loose. i played enough games to notice that. The later the game gets it gets more difficult for borg to win even with tact cubes. This is just from online experience gained. Although nanites are a must have for borg to survive and win the late game.
2. Scubes repair slowly, with regen module only slightly faster, but you must have an adapted photon torp and also emscube for cloak detect so you are unlikely to build a reg scube.
Result: if we have pro players than can micro well and know counters, they will repair the damaged ships, while your scubes take damage and are out of the game for some time. So basicly you can be out of ships cos they are too damaged and have zero loses. Thats the first weak thing. plus scube unit pathing can make it more dificult for micro, in team games especially.
Later you build dodechs which disable random subsystems, if you are lucky to disable engines you can get a sure kill.
3. A romulan scout can stay in borg base the whole game and cant be detected unless there is an emscube being atacked, nanites may do the job, not sure in this version, while for normal cloak you need a deployed dodech. You need to sacrifice a unit.
Result: you know what is borg building all the time, and borg lacks numbers so a deployed unit doesnt help.
4. To get any kind of research you need a 1200 dilith 600 trit building which is expensive for early or early-mid game. although research is free it takes time. Other races can research much earlier the proper counter specials like tricobalt torp etc. When you decide to build it you must have several nodes already deployed to enable construction of ships, cos that building takes a lot of time to build. Thats if you have one borg constructor, which is usually the case.
Result: In early-mid game other races get a slight advantage over borg cos of research although borg modules, give him some help.
5. Sphere is a ship which can take a lot of damage, but baslicly countered with autonomus ai easily, its usually targeted last if there are smaller ships to be destroyed. In 3vs3 can go down quite easily. Again with micromanagment loosing ships can be evaded easily unless borg picks of your retreating units from the back, havent seen that much, even with several loses you can defeat the borg force. Several spheres can do the job, (but im not a big fan of them), cos you cant micromanage then that good. and a sphere can make a physics blok to help other sphere escape. Using sphere specials when researched maybe a downside since you will loose special energy for regeneration.
6. So basicly a combo devastating atack, high energy slicer and nanites can give you sure kills.
Talking about opti of course. But by the time you get those things... And nanites are kind of reduced in this patch, but still powerfull.
7. Its just too vurneable to torpedo units, even with torpedo modules. Last is an opinion. Saw too many times that units even with several torpedo modules get destroyed by torpedo based units like excell 2.
This is written in assumption that we have some top players playing, which can micro well.
This contains several reasons that I want the costs and time to come down. It costs way too much to get started on those upgrades. And if I'm not mistaking, the price for the collective connections is a tad bit steep.
It also contains the primary reason I want shields on those units and/or enhanced armor. I have to agree with him on the opinion that the Borg are weak. The Borg may be powerful, but that power comes way too late. By the time you get enough resources to build a powerful vessel, the non-Borg opponents are already decimating your base. And the Borg are too dependent on help from non-Borg team mates. And that's another reason I want the costs and construction time to come down.
PS: I play online as "TChapman500"
posted on July 28th, 2010, 12:48 am
Sheva wrote:The borg are perfectly outbalanced. They do what no other ship can do: Kill a ship without letting it retreat. One beam on one torp is enough to kill a destroyer or cruiser. 7 attacks, 7 dead ships.
The problem: You have to stay in game in order to rech that level. The borg are weak in early and even in mid game, but wipe the floor in late game.
The only thing they lack is a good mixed tech thing.
Lol the borg are strong early, mid, and late game. Scubes rock. Early sphere rocks. Everything rocks for the borg
posted on July 28th, 2010, 12:51 am
Scube should have special that one-shots Akira~ 
posted on July 28th, 2010, 12:55 am
I think that Borg should have the following ability:
"Make a Locutus out of Any Race".
[b]- The Borg are specialized in snaring one member of any race and turning him into a ... messiah ... thingy ... that everyone will listen to or .... something. Instantly grants the Collective the knowledge of all other vessel's shield and weapon harmonics, making them useless.]/b]
Lasts 60 seconds with a cooldown of what ... 10 seconds?
How about that?
Tell you what, TCR_500 ... I'll play as Borg and you play as anything you want. I guaranTEE that you'll be begging for a Borg nerf. Better yet, have Dominus play with you. He's a better Borger than I am. You'll be SCREAMING for Sphere's to get nerfed because you'll never kill a single one.
"Make a Locutus out of Any Race".
[b]- The Borg are specialized in snaring one member of any race and turning him into a ... messiah ... thingy ... that everyone will listen to or .... something. Instantly grants the Collective the knowledge of all other vessel's shield and weapon harmonics, making them useless.]/b]
Lasts 60 seconds with a cooldown of what ... 10 seconds?
How about that?
Tell you what, TCR_500 ... I'll play as Borg and you play as anything you want. I guaranTEE that you'll be begging for a Borg nerf. Better yet, have Dominus play with you. He's a better Borger than I am. You'll be SCREAMING for Sphere's to get nerfed because you'll never kill a single one.
posted on July 28th, 2010, 6:55 am
I agree with that...early sphere is difficult for many factions since the lack of torpedo access.
posted on July 28th, 2010, 6:58 am
WHY CAN'T THE GALAXY'S SAUCER SECTION SEPARATE!?!?!?!? 
teehee!
teehee!posted on July 28th, 2010, 11:01 am
Heh... it gets everywhere, just like Star Trek.
posted on July 28th, 2010, 11:12 am
Lol is this a joke? Give the borg shields and more hull?? haahahaha:P Sry i cant take this serious...
Imo, the only thing that need to be fixed are some of the ship modules that never see the light of the day and are in most cases useless. Like holdingbeam module, more than one/two deflector module(sphere), Beam module on scube and the nanite factory modules special ablility(Needs to doo more).
ALso it would be nice if the borg were able to get their techlab earlier, this would give them more options:)
And yes as mentioned before by half the ppl on the forum, some bettter mixed tech options for the borg!:D
Imo, the only thing that need to be fixed are some of the ship modules that never see the light of the day and are in most cases useless. Like holdingbeam module, more than one/two deflector module(sphere), Beam module on scube and the nanite factory modules special ablility(Needs to doo more).
ALso it would be nice if the borg were able to get their techlab earlier, this would give them more options:)
And yes as mentioned before by half the ppl on the forum, some bettter mixed tech options for the borg!:D
posted on July 28th, 2010, 1:29 pm
Hmmm... if they were to make some real changes to the Borg then I would like to see more ships capable of assimilating with special weapons available like the holding bream or assimilation beam. Would be great if all borg ships could do this (except perhaps detector) to some extent.
The way I would have it is that Borg would be super at collecting other races ships but have to be more careful with their own (either due to increased costs or build times or some other mechanism). Captured ships would possibly get regeneration modules but I feel that would cause buckets of work for the devs, so an alternate variant would be some sort of regeneration station where you could regen your damaged ships (possibly like a shipyard but working much much slower).
Therefore as the game progressed you would actually see Borg fleets largely comprised of non-Borg vessels. Its how I like to play as the Borg against the AI once i've stolen an enemy constructor or shipyard.
As things stand at the moment mainly people do not seem to do much assimilation as the Borg. "Resistance is futile, you will NOT be assimilated, you will be blasted into oblivion" should be the current catchphrase of the Borg in FO.
Still, I do love playing as the Borg. They are a challenge to get started, but once you are up and running you can become very powerful.
The way I would have it is that Borg would be super at collecting other races ships but have to be more careful with their own (either due to increased costs or build times or some other mechanism). Captured ships would possibly get regeneration modules but I feel that would cause buckets of work for the devs, so an alternate variant would be some sort of regeneration station where you could regen your damaged ships (possibly like a shipyard but working much much slower).
Therefore as the game progressed you would actually see Borg fleets largely comprised of non-Borg vessels. Its how I like to play as the Borg against the AI once i've stolen an enemy constructor or shipyard.
As things stand at the moment mainly people do not seem to do much assimilation as the Borg. "Resistance is futile, you will NOT be assimilated, you will be blasted into oblivion" should be the current catchphrase of the Borg in FO.
Still, I do love playing as the Borg. They are a challenge to get started, but once you are up and running you can become very powerful.
posted on July 28th, 2010, 2:03 pm
Assimilation should be part of the techtree...and not for collecting ships. In the show you dont see assimilated ships (often). And to be true, against an Assim avatar many ships are already useless in early-game due to their low crew. Additional assim abilities make this even worse.
posted on July 28th, 2010, 6:46 pm
There's only been one instance where the Federation has battled an assimilated vessel. I assume that the Borg are more likely to recycle the smaller assimilated vessels for more resources, and the bigger vessels are more likely to be used.
And I would like to see most of the vessels carry assimilation technology.
And I would like to see most of the vessels carry assimilation technology.
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