Idea for klingons supply.

posted on May 9th, 2011, 3:15 pm

Why doesn't that work well for klingons? They can cloak, they are fast and can upgrade speed;

also they have safe-distance killers like the Sang and the powerful tank-backbone Vor'Cha.

thats fine if u start with those strats, but less fun if u start with field yard ships. it isnt impossible, in fact if u micro well early on its not even difficult. it just makes it seriously boring.

posted on May 9th, 2011, 3:16 pm

Safe distance against fed turrets?

posted on May 9th, 2011, 3:33 pm

Why not just switch the supply gain on rankup to supply gain on kill or capture?

posted on May 9th, 2011, 3:35 pm

supply gain on capture sounds fun

posted on May 9th, 2011, 4:07 pm

As the first I remember to suggest a capture bonus, I wouldn't mind supply for taking a ship. Should be a bit higher than for killing them, as it's usually a lot harder to do.

[Nebula_Class_Ftw]

posted on May 9th, 2011, 4:29 pm

Last edited by Nebula_Class_Ftw on May 9th, 2011, 4:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I think they should gain supply in battle, upon killing ships. This would be a lot like the current system, except vets get supply too and you don't have the odd situation of blowing up an Intrepid and getting no supply just because your Vor'cha was 2 xp below rankup.

Supply gain should be proportional to the supply cost of the ship killed, as well as being affected by what ship you use to kill with (this way not only are Vor'chas, Taq B'rels, etc better at getting you supply, you're also rewarded for taking out the big targets that are harder to kill.) I'm thinking about one quarter of a ship's supply cost for a K'beajQ killing that ship, and around a third for a Vor'cha killing that ship.
The exact gain should be random, but with not too big of a possible range. This way going from expansion to expansion isn't quite as a good as fleet combat, since the random range will make some miners only give you 0 supply.

As for abuses: makes suiciding ships not viable, as you need them to actually kill things to get supply. And it means that kiting won't do you a whole lot of good.


And supply gain on capture sounds pretty cool too.

posted on May 9th, 2011, 5:35 pm

I think they should gain supply in battle, upon killing ships. This would be a lot like the current system, except vets get supply too and you don't have the odd situation of blowing up an Intrepid and getting no supply just because your Vor'cha was 2 xp below rankup.

Supply gain should be proportional to the supply cost of the ship killed, as well as being affected by what ship you use to kill with (this way not only are Vor'chas, Taq B'rels, etc better at getting you supply, you're also rewarded for taking out the big targets that are harder to kill.) I'm thinking about one quarter of a ship's supply cost for a K'beajQ killing that ship, and around a third for a Vor'cha killing that ship.
The exact gain should be random, but with not too big of a possible range. This way going from expansion to expansion isn't quite as a good as fleet combat, since the random range will make some miners only give you 0 supply.

As for abuses: makes suiciding ships not viable, as you need them to actually kill things to get supply. And it means that kiting won't do you a whole lot of good.


And supply gain on capture sounds pretty cool too.

Like that Idea most. Just bacause with the supply on rankup I have a major problem. You can only gain Supplies by rankup. So if the enemy has many ships it is easyer. But if the enemy uses big (and far less) ships (or even is borg) you are in trubble.You are ristrictet by your enemy. He is not by you. Bacause now you will get the same amount of supplies for a taccube as for a Saber if you, get some...

posted on May 9th, 2011, 5:48 pm

I like the idea of a station that increases supply gains, I like the general idea of having 2 special stations like the Romulans do and only one can be built.  It adds another dimension to gameplay.

One thing I want to see is bonuses for killing different things.  For example, miners and stations grant supplies when they're killed.  Perhaps specific ships could be good at it.  Personally I think the B'rel should lose its tactical weapon arrays and gain a new passive that increases damage against miners and constructors, to truly represent its role as a raider and give it something useful.

How about this ability, built into troopships and Martok's bonus for Vorcha:

Subjugate Civilians: can only be used on mining stations and non-borg ships without weapons, once their shields are down.  Instantly captures the ship without affecting its crew count.

Then make it so non-klingon ships controlled by a klingon player can be decommissioned for 3x their suppy cost, instead of the usual resources.

This way, a Klingon player can just kill enemy mining, or they can actually capture the ships and send them home to strip them of supplies.  It's raiding in its truest form, not getting metal resources but the precious cargo of your victims.

It could be taken a step further by giving the Klingons the ability to jettison mining equipment on captured miners, not giving them a gun but making them go faster so they are less likely to be killed on the way "home."

posted on May 9th, 2011, 6:05 pm

brels are already good at killing miners. maybe its special could be changed to tractor an enemy miner and slowly turn its hull into supplies and stops allied ships shooting at the miner in question like holding beam, the hull goes down to 25% hull then the beam wont work and the ship gets shot at again.

maybe the supplies gained per second could be 1, and the process lasts 10 seconds to get down to 25% hull. during the process the brel has no engines or weapons or shields. the beam can be stopped any time to restore these systems and run.

so you get 10 supplies by a full use of it. maybe the completion of such a special would instantly cause a rankup to get some more supplies.

posted on May 9th, 2011, 6:06 pm

Instant capture probably wouldn't work, as any civilian ships would likely have military-grade security on at least during a conflict. Any military would protect its interests.

posted on May 9th, 2011, 6:23 pm

Instant capture probably wouldn't work, as any civilian ships would likely have military-grade security on at least during a conflict. Any military would protect its interests.

it wasnt instant, and it wouldnt capture the miner in question, it would leave it damaged after the beam was complete.

it replicates what the brel did to yates freighter in ds9. tractor it and threaten to raid it.

and having it as a special would justify the usefullness

posted on May 9th, 2011, 6:26 pm

I was talking about this one, before your post. There's 'instant' in there.

Instantly captures the ship without affecting its crew count.

posted on May 9th, 2011, 6:28 pm

I was talking about this one, before your post. There's 'instant' in there.

oh i thought u were talking about mine since u didnt quote

posted on May 9th, 2011, 7:08 pm

Instant capture probably wouldn't work, as any civilian ships would likely have military-grade security on at least during a conflict. Any military would protect its interests.

Yes but that doesn't stop the Tavara or Borg boarding.  The assumption I'm making is that the Klingons sent over 20-some shock troops, killed the military complement (which would be smaller on a mining ship than a combat ship) and forced the rest of the crew into service.

The supply capture beam I like, but I don't think it should be on the Brel.  The Klingon supply system already works for low-tech engagements where lots of ships rank-up.  What needs to be improved is their middle-late game supply gains.  The miner-capture ability could be done more easily at an expansion with turrets than a supply-capture beam.

And in fact it wouldn't need to be a fancy special, it could simply be a bonus to transporting vs civilian ships, say 3/1.  Enemy crew reduced by 3 for each Klingon (right now I think it's 3/2)

[Nebula_Class_Ftw]

posted on May 9th, 2011, 7:48 pm

Last edited by Nebula_Class_Ftw on May 9th, 2011, 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Every crew member of a mining station placed right next to the front lines is trained for combat and carries a weapon for defense. You cannot simply kill a small "military complement", as that's pretty much the entire crew.
The security forces are just there to make sure no spies get on board (they don't always do a good job), make sure the rest of the crew isn't up to no good, and to coordinate defense.

The Tavara and the Cube are late-game ships that require significant techup, you're talking midgame stuff that only needs 1 (or 2, for Vutpa) research station(s).

Also, I'm pretty sure it would be OP to have every 1 Klingon take out 3 mining station crew. Say hello to four Taq'roja B'rels and their ability to get rid of your expansion entirely before your fleet comes back.