Slight changes on the Dominion faction

posted on October 8th, 2011, 9:58 am

vessels that counter the dodecahedron are not immune to disabling, just a lot more resistant

according to the dode weapons ordnance odf the disable percentage for the brel is exactly 0 for every subsystem but sensors, for which its reduced. is it supposed to be greater than 0 for other subsystems on the brel?

posted on October 8th, 2011, 10:32 am

the disable chances of the dodecahedron are relatively small and after multiplication with all reductions (system value counts too), it might end up to be too small for the accuracy FO uses

posted on October 8th, 2011, 10:38 am

the disable chances of the dodecahedron are relatively small and after multiplication with all reductions (system value counts too), it might end up to be too small for the accuracy FO uses

so for the brel it is meant to be close to 0, but there isnt enough accuracy to represent it, so it just ends up being 0?

the brel doesnt exactly have a high system value at 5, yet the disable chances are so low they end up as 0. so wouldnt the other counters (monsoon, s2, galaxy, cehlaer, all of which have higher system values than the brel) all be 0 as well? might as well just say the dode never disables these ships as that's what it would be in practice. which i think is reasonable, these ships should hurt dodes as they are counters.

posted on October 8th, 2011, 3:16 pm

o rly? your post started with "im not gonna bother arguing". then what followed was you defending your point by arguing...

you couldn't resist even 1 second.

bombers cost less than s2s in dil/tri and sup. yet we easily see people make an s2 spam. dominion are very good at setting up spams. double yard bombers also gets you a yard at your expansion, so your mining losses will be less. once energy for meta d is gone it takes quite a few leahvals to kill a miner before it can get to a repair dock.

comparing bombers/leahvals to brels/dodes is a mistake.

brels are shorter range than dodes and dodes have torps that do improved damage to the small brels. the dodes also have the disabling effect.

bombers are longer range than leahvals and leahvals dont have any increased damage to bombers. they do base damage.

whats even more striking is that bombers are more than enough to take down leahvals. it was shown in a replay that breen cruisers can take down leahvals with the heavy torp spam. torp spam crushes the leahval. breen cruisers dont have a passive that helps, they rely solely on the base damage of their torps.

Lol yeah i guess so.

Well i just tested and it seems you were right i didnt miss as often as i thought and they did alot of damage to the lehevals surprisingly but i wasnt facing a very tough opponent, however the lahevals were doing massive damage to the bombers and had i not gained an advantage early on it may have turned out differently.

But briels still do not counter dodes.

posted on October 8th, 2011, 5:21 pm

Bombers will counter Leahvals.

B'rels will generally not counter Dodes.  Even though the B'rel are resistant to the disable, they take HUGE extra damage from the Dode adapted torps.  In 99% of cases building B'rel vs. Borg is a waste of resources.

[MrXT]

posted on October 8th, 2011, 6:38 pm

Last edited by MrXT on October 8th, 2011, 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Bombers will counter Leahvals.

B'rels will generally not counter Dodes.  Even though the B'rel are resistant to the disable, they take HUGE extra damage from the Dode adapted torps.  In 99% of cases building B'rel vs. Borg is a waste of resources.

ninja'd by boggz


I feel i need to add this just for the record however that i have now seen lahevals be coutnered by bombers but if that romulan were to switch ships to say rhiens, the dom now has to spend ages building a proto to successfully counter that and thats where the dom are getting owned.

posted on October 8th, 2011, 7:31 pm

The one thing that the other races can do that the Dominion cannot do is pre-countering.  Meaning you predict what ships your enemy wants to build and start countering them before they get theirs out.  The Dominion can switch production, but due to their prototype mechanic the counter won't be effective for a few minutes.

What this means is, every time the enemy starts building a different ship-type a Dominion player has to go back to a defensive strategy until he has a fleet that can handle this new threat.  It's easy to box the Dominion in using a series of rotating hard-counters for their ships.

Here's an idea: (I love saying that )

Since the Prototypes are the equivalent of other races' tech, they suffer the unique disadvantage of costing supply.  What if the prototype costs were increased very slightly and the supply cost for Prototypes was halved?

posted on October 8th, 2011, 7:40 pm

The prototypes should just be axed imo, no other races need this so it isnt needed for the dominion either and balance could be better attained by doing the doms similar to the feds.

posted on October 8th, 2011, 10:39 pm

Tryptic has some really good thoughts, I really like the idea of no supply miner included with the synthesizer- that helps to reduce the stations cost and also helps to incorporate the construction/miner toggle.

Tryptic makes another good point about the proto types they really limit the dominion for countering purposes. Perhaps the Protos should build faster, cost more, use less supply and be slightly weaker than the mainline vessels. I know that seems counter intuitive, but I believe this would balance itself out. Besides you could always justify it by saying the protos are stripped out bare essential vessels.

posted on October 8th, 2011, 11:52 pm

The prototypes should just be axed imo, no other races need this so it isnt needed for the dominion either and balance could be better attained by doing the doms similar to the feds.

I agree it's the one thing I dislike about the Dominion and is a major disadvantage as other races when they loose their research stations don't loose their research.

posted on October 9th, 2011, 3:01 am

Well with that in mind, maybe after a prototype is built it should be permanent that the mainline vessels can be constructed. It does make the most sense. Hell the current construction costs and time could probably be retained as a result.... And this turning into a discussion we've had before lol

posted on October 9th, 2011, 9:04 am

Unlike other factions, the Dominion uses extreme mass production, which completely denies the option to fix mistakes in ship design during an active production series. That's why they have to build prototypes to have something to copy from.

This mechanic might not be everyones favourit, but its not ment to be We want to create diverse factions, and its a good sign if a player does not like all of them. thats actually diversity.

The Dominion will get a quite intense redo once their faction redo comes in, focusing more on mass production and similar, very dominion-like aspects

posted on October 9th, 2011, 11:30 am

Fine Optec, but can we get an interim solution by changins some of the stats of ships...just to make Dominion a bit better...noone expects huge changes but like they are now they cannot stay.

posted on October 9th, 2011, 11:45 am

The next patch will change a lot for all the factions, so yep, there will be changes

posted on October 9th, 2011, 12:27 pm

Unlike other factions, the Dominion uses extreme mass production, which completely denies the option to fix mistakes in ship design during an active production series. That's why they have to build prototypes to have something to copy from.

This mechanic might not be everyones favourit, but its not ment to be We want to create diverse factions, and its a good sign if a player does not like all of them. thats actually diversity.

The Dominion will get a quite intense redo once their faction redo comes in, focusing more on mass production and similar, very dominion-like aspects

You know you guys keep trying to fix the dom but i cant remember a single patch where there wasnt a problem with the dominion there is always an overpowered ship because the only real option is to spam a single vessel untill you gain the upper hand before tech'ing up.

In every patch i can remember something has been done to tweat the dom and its never worked so i dont know why you think this next patch will fix them but ill look forward to seeing whats done but i doubt its over in the patch after that youll be trying to find a way to fix the new issues with them wether is because they are now to strong or because they are even weaker.

Almost all issues the dom have are because of those dam prototypes.