Resource Distribution Need fixing
posted on June 1st, 2009, 3:39 pm
posted on June 1st, 2009, 3:46 pm
I apologize for the rudeness ahead of time, but... in a word: No.
Play FO 3.0PR and you'll find that the balance was miserable because there was no point to tech up. More powerful ships cost too much for their weapon benefits, so EVERYBODY spammed the first or second tier destroyer. Under no circumstance would I desire a return to such gameplay, and lowering the costs of destroyers would only make destroyer spam more opportunistic and viable which would utterly defeat the balance that has been currently achieved. In regards to your ideas of making the races more similar-why on earth would that be desired?
"Plus, stations that are unarmed should cost less dilithium. Because the dilithium is used to power tings such as weapons and sheilds, if there are no weapons than Dithitium should be reduced because of a decrease in need. "
We are talking gameplay I thought, not canon?! Maybe you'd care to think of it this way though: stations need more energy and more shielding, and thus more dilithium is needed
. Either way, gameplay should not cater to perceived canon in my opinion.
Play FO 3.0PR and you'll find that the balance was miserable because there was no point to tech up. More powerful ships cost too much for their weapon benefits, so EVERYBODY spammed the first or second tier destroyer. Under no circumstance would I desire a return to such gameplay, and lowering the costs of destroyers would only make destroyer spam more opportunistic and viable which would utterly defeat the balance that has been currently achieved. In regards to your ideas of making the races more similar-why on earth would that be desired?
"Plus, stations that are unarmed should cost less dilithium. Because the dilithium is used to power tings such as weapons and sheilds, if there are no weapons than Dithitium should be reduced because of a decrease in need. "
We are talking gameplay I thought, not canon?! Maybe you'd care to think of it this way though: stations need more energy and more shielding, and thus more dilithium is needed
. Either way, gameplay should not cater to perceived canon in my opinion.posted on June 1st, 2009, 4:00 pm
Well... Each race must have some form of gradually gaining supply without having to buy, buy, and buy again. Buying supplies is for instant needs! There should also be a way how to gather supplies independently. Like the Feds having a trading station with a cargo ship coming every minute with a small quantity like 50 or 75 supply units. Or the Klingons would be able to have a ship that when cloaked can go to an enemy mining station in beam in supplies from the station and deliver it to the Klingon mining platform. Or the Romulans can have it when a Starbase is built you gain 200 supply units. There should be something for each race where there is a gradual increase and an instant increase. 
posted on June 1st, 2009, 4:16 pm
posted on June 1st, 2009, 4:18 pm
1337_64M3R wrote:Well... Each race must have some form of gradually gaining supply without having to buy, buy, and buy again. Buying supplies is for instant needs! There should also be a way how to gather supplies independently. Like the Feds having a trading station with a cargo ship coming every minute with a small quantity like 50 or 75 supply units. Or the Klingons would be able to have a ship that when cloaked can go to an enemy mining station in beam in supplies from the station and deliver it to the Klingon mining platform. Or the Romulans can have it when a Starbase is built you gain 200 supply units. There should be something for each race where there is a gradual increase and an instant increase.
In your opinion. I find it frustrating when new members demand things from the Dev team, without even suggesting that their ideas might be a result of inexperience or different taste.
I happen to agree with you, a Federation Trading station to give supplies or something else might be nice, but right now gameplay and balance is fantastic compared to what it has been.
FO doesn't need anything to make it better.
posted on June 1st, 2009, 4:45 pm
posted on June 2nd, 2009, 5:58 am
posted on June 2nd, 2009, 6:01 am
It is not honorable to do that to your allies, but perhaps not to your enemies 
posted on June 2nd, 2009, 6:29 am
posted on June 2nd, 2009, 8:10 am
1337_64M3R wrote:Okay, I might be a N00|3! But that doesn't mean I have no 0P1N10N!I've been M0|)|)1N6 PH0R 7HR33 4n|D 4 H4|f Y34R5! I H4V3 |333N 7RY1N6 70 M4K3 73H U|71M473 M0|) 4N|) Y0U <R171<153 MY 0P1N10N?
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He wasn't criticising your opinion, he even said he agreed with it, he was just saying it was frustrating when new members start demanding stuff from the dev team. No need to overreact like that.
posted on June 2nd, 2009, 10:18 am
posted on June 3rd, 2009, 7:06 am
posted on June 3rd, 2009, 11:33 am
Last edited by mimesot on June 3rd, 2009, 12:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
posted on June 3rd, 2009, 12:54 pm
Last edited by 1337 64M3R on June 3rd, 2009, 1:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
posted on June 3rd, 2009, 1:24 pm
Please don't do that Gamer (plus, I have yet to see you online... though I haven't seen many people online at all lately--of course that could just as well be my fault since I haven't been on Lamespy very regularly lately), just be careful not to take things against you. As was said before, being the "new guy" means very little; you'll find that you will be assimilated very quickly 
In regards to tri/dil costs for stations etc, Optec had a very nice response in another thread:
Thus you see that the tri/dil costs are in units perhaps, and not necessarily in terms of relative amounts (aka, 100 picograms of dilithium and 150 tons of dilithium). In terms of technologies costing mostly supplies, we have a beginning trend with the Dominion for pretty much everything to cost a significant amount of supplies. As you said about balancing, I think the way it is done now goes all the way down to how many resources the miners collect... so I'm not sure how the system could be rebalanced exactly without changing all of it
In regards to tri/dil costs for stations etc, Optec had a very nice response in another thread:
just some thoughts from my side:
Dilithium is a crystal, used in antimatter reactors
Tritanium is a metal thats used to build much of the spaceframe and interior of vessels (note that its not the armor, that would be deuterium and other stuff)
An average military vessel requires large amounts of energy to supply heavy shield generators and powerfull weapons. Therefore it will probably have one large - or multiple - energy cores, leading to a larger usage of dilithium.
An anverage science vessel wont have very powerfull weapons and shieldings, but other systems that may consume large amounts of energy, like high resolution scanners, special containment fields and the like. it will probably require less energy then the average military vessel, but still a good deal. On the other side, the very advanced sensors and science labs or computers of those vessels need a much more advanced interior then a warship like the defiant, so its tritanium usage should be higher.
You can see that reflected in the comparsion of military and support vessels.
Research consumes large amounts of tritanium, as it requires to build prototypes, test weaponry, new facilities and the like. Usually you dont build a new power generator for every research operation, but feed from an existing energy source - thats why it consumes much more tritanium then dilithium.
Thats ofcourse just some thoughts behind the resource management in Fleet Operations. Resources had to be drastically reduced to make an RTS out of the Star Trek universe. Antimatter, Deuterium, Bio-Proto-Material, medical supplies an Romulan Ale would also be very important resources, but we had to select two.
You can also argue that there is no unit given in which Dilithium and Tritanium are messured in game. Of course a powergenerator consumes much less Dilithium (lets say 10 kg for a large one), while a starship is made tons of tritanium for all its decks. Out of usability reasons we just messure it in "units", but one could say that Tritanium is messured in tons and dilithium in gram or something like that.
Of cause there are still many flaws to these ideas. Romulan vessels dont use any anti-matter based generators, so they would probably not use Dilithium at all. And who knows what the Borg feed of. But well, its a real-time-strategy-game, not a simulation - although a simulation would be a very very interessting project, too. But perhaps a boring one
Thus you see that the tri/dil costs are in units perhaps, and not necessarily in terms of relative amounts (aka, 100 picograms of dilithium and 150 tons of dilithium). In terms of technologies costing mostly supplies, we have a beginning trend with the Dominion for pretty much everything to cost a significant amount of supplies. As you said about balancing, I think the way it is done now goes all the way down to how many resources the miners collect... so I'm not sure how the system could be rebalanced exactly without changing all of it
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