I'm a Little Turtle, short and stout.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 1:06 pm

Any one saying turtling is a problem can play against me : ).

posted on May 21st, 2010, 1:19 pm

i am a turtle player myself, the way the resources are, and the capabilities of a turrets decides if its worth the effort vs the enemy player and what race is used.

for example i play romulans, its not worth it at all and dont build any. against any race, the turrets are piss poor weak.

the klingon turrets, although seldom strong, they take too much space and completely ineffective against big borg targets and artillery units. would only build a few if it was ffa and one was borg and the other was non borg, if it was two non borg, i would build them rather then a fleet, and if they are both borg, it would be pointless. the only really worthwhile thing to do is hope the vorcha specials are ready, the brel gravity mines and qews polaron field is good.

the federation turrets, cheaper then klingon turrets, versatile against a range of ship classes, the clear fav is torps, much stronger and arty range, the obvious mayson turrets are very effective against borg targets when clustered enough. worth it, but the resource cost in the long run and thats including supply cost is a big one, however it would depend on how strong the borg fleet is, any other fleets is quickly torn to shreds. no need to test, i have done it a number of times against massive ai fleets and its usually over in less then a minute.

the dominion turrets, there is a difference in strength with perimeter and turret, the turret is very weak when attacked, the perimeter is way too strong and the starbase is adequate, the perimeter is hardly a threat for several borg cubes, defenses are ineffective against most other big fleets, its not worth the effort.

the borg, that turret in my mind is just plain terrible and useless even against a pack of level 1 ships. the torpedo weapon it has need a bit more damage and fire at a faster rate. its not worth it, rather have the docs with the other abilities.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 1:41 pm

What's wrong w/ turtling?

it fails in any good rts against competent opponent

posted on May 21st, 2010, 1:46 pm

it fails in any good rts against competent opponent

that would imply a nasty phrase is behind your distrust of turtle players, i would also point out that turtle players may have the same low regard that you place on them as they do to you.

as for anything else, take it to the battlefield .

posted on May 21st, 2010, 1:49 pm

Tom is quite a decent player Canny - you can take what he says at face value

Turtling will always fail because turtling precludes expansion, which precludes a resource advantage, which means you are stuck trying to hole-up in a single base or expansion, unable to defend either, since turrets cannot move.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 1:52 pm

Turrets also often lack the range to protect against artillery ships.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 1:55 pm

until upgraded, if it was fed turrets that problem is negated.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 2:01 pm

The Quantum Turret has its own problems, most notably the inability to focus on a specific ship. Splitting its shots across several nearby ships means you're gonna need luck to take out the artillery before it takes out your turrets.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 3:36 pm

Lol. Good to hear what people are saying. I'm glad others agree that Fed turrets are OP and Rom turrets are UP.

But it seems to be getting off topic abit 
I posted yhis thread to really say that Rom turret system need to be buffed. Such as my idea, that Alt-End also agrees with (thanks btw alt).

posted on May 21st, 2010, 3:59 pm

the klingon turrets, although seldom strong, they take too much space and completely ineffective against big borg targets and artillery units. would only build a few if it was ffa and one was borg and the other was non borg, if it was two non borg, i would build them rather then a fleet, and if they are both borg, it would be pointless. the only really worthwhile thing to do is hope the vorcha specials are ready, the brel gravity mines and qews polaron field is good.

Klingon turrents are either the strongest or the second strongest turrets in the game plus they never miss and a quite effective vs all kinds of ships.

Also turtling will only ever work in a team game if your ally keeps the enemies busy. In that same game you are usally considered to be more of a liability than an asset

posted on May 21st, 2010, 6:25 pm

hm, turtling ... turtling does not mean to stay in one base and hide behind a ton of big mofo turrets. It does mean to minimize the risk when u expand or in other words, expand slowly. It is a valid tactic, and it worked to some degree also in some good rpgs, but due to the lack of realy big artillery weapons in FO i gues its far away from being the best tactic vs a skilled human opponent.well  ... against the AI it does work very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very good because the AI is plain and simple stupid

posted on May 21st, 2010, 6:41 pm

@ Brother Gabriel:

  I've heard that called "creeping" or "base-walking" when you expand slowly and turret up everything you make.  It's very easy to do that with the Feds right now.

  Turtling is indeed hiding behind a wall of Turrets and teching (usually) to der most uber monster thing you can.  The very fact that Canny complains "the perimeter is hardly a threat for several borg cubes" shows that he's even placing those two things side by side.  Cubes crack bases.  SEVERAL Cubes destroy everything.  Perimeters are for stopping fleets of small ships, not Cubes.  Fleets are for destroying Cubes .

  Look guys, the defences in this game are not meant to be blocking walls.  The Devs have said that this is "FLEETops", not "BASE/TURRETops".  The turrets are supposed to be there to provide you with a deterrent and a respite from roaming raiders and a place to fall back to in case a fleet engagement goes poorly.

  You are not SUPPOSED to be able to turtle ... there HAS to be a way to crack a Turtler or the game effectively ends.  Artillery exists to stop Turrets.  Turrets exist to bolster fleet defence and stop raiders.  Raiders exist to keep an enemy choking for resources and keep their attention drawn away.  Everything has it's purpose, but the purpose of Turrets is NOT to hole up and hide.  Yu can try that, but it's not gonna work in the long run.

  Romulan turrets, I agree, need a bit SOMEthing because right now I find them a waste of resources.  Fed Turrets really need to lose that Ablative Armor because they CAN turtle.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 6:57 pm

feds can build hard to crack defenses. but even then, if they go all out on defense turrets you can expand to all the moon pairs and they wont have a fleet to stop you. then just play the resource game. build 10 cubes and steamroll them. the turrets will never win. just delay defeat.

posted on May 21st, 2010, 7:00 pm

If someone wants to 'turtle', they're essentially defeating themselves. Why complain about people almost helping you win?

posted on May 21st, 2010, 7:09 pm

feds can build hard to crack defenses. but even then, if they go all out on defense turrets you can expand to all the moon pairs and they wont have a fleet to stop you. then just play the resource game. build 10 cubes and steamroll them. the turrets will never win. just delay defeat.

  I agree with that logic, but it's REALLY easy for Feds to throw up a couple phaser turrets or more at each expansion.  3 phaser turrets back by even a meager fleet of ships can lay waste to a significant number of ships.