Federation - Small Destroyer Saber

posted on June 15th, 2011, 9:17 am

Hello folks,

I played a lot FleetOps... I love your mod/game  . So the last time, I spend some time to optimise my gameplay with the federation. For this, I - of course - played some matches und read tips, guides. When I watched some videos by you guys playing the federation, I never saw someone which used the Saber. If a unit in a strategy will not be used, in my opinion, it is a sign of a useless unit - so the unit is unbalanced.

The saber is a unit, which should be used in the early game phase... perhaps you can make the saber more attractive for this part (less construction time, less ressouces, more power, important skills ... or somethink else).... what do you think?

Otherwise, if unit will not be used you should delete the unit out of the game...

posted on June 15th, 2011, 10:02 am

I may be incorrect in this, because I haven't really had the chance to test the Saber in 3.2.5, but in the previous versions it performed very well on the field, and filled its role. You must not count on the Saber as a formidable warship, like the defiant, which, - given the proper situation - can outclass most vessels single handedly. It has its use, when used in masses, with hyper imp. drive, it can pack quite a punch at distracting the enemy.

About changing its attributes: This may be a very hard task to solve. If you give it more damage, this tiny ship might get a bit overpowered. As I said, mostly it should be used in masses, and a fleet of Sabers, devastating much larger ships, and even having a passive defense "skill" is a bit... frightening sight.

On the other hand, lowering its cost, or build time would just make it way more a spammer ship, as it already is / was, by the way. That would kinda remind me of stock Armada 2 Saber, as it had no real value, and could be barely called cannon fodder.

I do not mean to teach you, or something, but I can't really agree with you on this.

[Nerd0001]

posted on June 15th, 2011, 10:12 am

Last edited by Nerd0001 on June 15th, 2011, 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

Thx for your comment  . I know that balancing is very difficult... it is a process which takes month or concerning to StarCraft, years.

But If I look the videos of the Spring Tournament, no one of the Fed-Players used Sabers (because the ships are canon fodder, but not so strong as little Zergs ) . So I concluse, there must be something going wrong... If your are right, the Sabers must be a part of their gameplay.   

posted on June 15th, 2011, 11:14 am

the most common strat for sabres is sabre spam, problem with that is the cover fire special is a replaceweapon, so you end up with massive micro issues, ships that forget orders and fly to their death etc.

it works good against b5 rush. as it can easily kite the fighters and get rank after rank.

a few of them can be a risky raiding party with hyper impulse on. they can still strike from long range but you will need a lot of them as their phasers are puny, even against miners. and if u get them near a turret they will get hurt badly. escaping shouldnt be too hard with hyper impulse, but if the enemy is a cloaking race its likely they will eventually get lucky and decloak on top of your fleet of papier-mâché ships, then they die painfully. most people use monsoons for raiding instead tbh, as they are fast naturally, and have the hugely effective proximity torpedo to allow them to fire and run.

posted on June 15th, 2011, 11:26 am

I use saber when i play as fed. I even asimilate them when I play as the borg and they are nice ships , the only real problem is if you dont get them on safe distance AI will make them priority targets.

posted on June 15th, 2011, 11:33 am

I use saber when i play as fed. I even asimilate them when I play as the borg and they are nice ships , the only real problem is if you dont get them on safe distance AI will make them priority targets.

that can actually be handy in some specific late game scenarios. if the enemy has torpy ships such as big D or sovvie then a few sabres (maybe 3 or 4) with hyper impulse on can be useful, they will very likely die, but they are cheap, and the enemy will waste a percentage of their fire missing the sabres. killing the sabres will take time, and they wont get huge ranks from them, sabres arent worth much xp 

posted on June 15th, 2011, 11:51 am

Do you have some replays, where I can see these Sabre tactics?

posted on June 15th, 2011, 11:59 am

Do you have some replays, where I can see these Sabre tactics?

there was a 1v1 on duel 2 where boggz used sabres to smack b5s.

posted on June 15th, 2011, 1:01 pm

Thx for your comment  . I know that balancing is very difficult... it is a process which takes month or concerning to StarCraft, years.

The balancing of FO is under construction and has been redone several times since 2002 (probably longer)...

posted on June 15th, 2011, 2:04 pm

When I play the Federation, which is quite often, I either do Sabre Spam or Warp-in Rush with the occasional Monsoon/Intrepid spam.

I find Sabre spam very effective in team games and is something many players don't encounter and can sometimes put them often as they are expecting Warpins or Monssons/Intrepids.

I generally prefer playing with the low end ships more, rather than it just being a battleship/cruiser brawl.

But yeah the Sabre is one of my favourite Federation units and if used correctly and early on and really hurt your enemy especially in team games of 3vs3 or 4vs4. 

posted on June 15th, 2011, 2:10 pm

Hmm... ok, I see I have to work on my strategy... thx for your hints! 

posted on June 15th, 2011, 2:55 pm

I use sabers but the micro issues caused by cover fire has made me steer clear of them for the time being

posted on June 15th, 2011, 6:11 pm

I play Feds very rarely but when I do, Sabres are the first thing coming out of my yard. 2or 3 Sabres are a nice addition to an early Fed Fleet, since they are small, long ranged, pretty fast and even tank against pulse weaponry(which seems to be the hardest part for ints/Monsoons).
In fact I don't understand why Fed players don't use them often. I guess monsoons are simply cheap enough to ignore sabres. Additionally Feds have mainly defense passives which makes tanks not that important(as for Klingons for example). And even though they are long ranged their damage output is too small to do any harm in small matches. I did have a match in 3.2.3. I think, where a Fed player in a 3v3 could hold off 2(!) other players with Sabres only. He double(or even triple) yarded them, no ship came close enough to get them all(even not Klingons, they simply moved out and kited).
There are interesting and effective ways to use Sabres, but Feds also have a lot of other very effective strategies, pushing the Sabres a bit to the background.

posted on June 15th, 2011, 6:17 pm

I play Feds very rarely but when I do, Sabres are the first thing coming out of my yard. 2or 3 Sabres are a nice addition to an early Fed Fleet, since they are small, long ranged, pretty fast and even tank against pulse weaponry(which seems to be the hardest part for ints/Monsoons).
In fact I don't understand why Fed players don't use them often. I guess monsoons are simply cheap enough to ignore sabres. Additionally Feds have mainly defense passives which makes tanks not that important(as for Klingons for example). And even though they are long ranged their damage output is too small to do any harm in small matches. I did have a match in 3.2.3. I think, where a Fed player in a 3v3 could hold off 2(!) other players with Sabres only. He double(or even triple) yarded them, no ship came close enough to get them all(even not Klingons, they simply moved out and kited).
There are interesting and effective ways to use Sabres, but Feds also have a lot of other very effective strategies, pushing the Sabres a bit to the background.

I think I was that player

Yeah, sabers are really awesome in team games. Building them always prevents your enemy from getting good victories (shoot the sabers first, you don't kil the big ships and you don't get ranks. shoot the big ships first, you're gonna get a crapton of sabersxs thrown your way.), whic his really important..

posted on June 16th, 2011, 1:50 pm

Sabres are a perfect counter to Dominion Bombers. Their low defense value means that they will be targeted first while avoiding getting hit almost completely. Plus their long range means that they deal increased damage to bombers and can keep up with them in speed.