Dom Fighter too strong?

posted on December 29th, 2009, 9:19 pm

Thanks for the welcome and yes I am a girl lol.  Yes I was talking about those bug ships from DS9, in the show they were pretty weak on their own after Starfleet adapted to the shields to work with their poleron beams but in the game they seem pretty strong, my Defiant Class ships in the game, let along others have problems with them, I usually have to group a few ships together to be able to destroy the Fighters or Attack Destroyer or whatever you want to call them.

Here is the ship I was refering too Jem'Hadar fighter - Memory Alpha, the Star Trek Wiki

I think perhaps they are too strong is what i was saying, They should be easy to destroy but dangerous in large groups

The danger with making them spammable (i.e. easy to pump out in exceptionally high numbers) is that it alters the early-game dynamic in ways that are difficult to fully predict, and some that are sure to be negative.  For instance, a skilled player could easily choke your resource-gathering operations before you could build any ships able to pose a serious threat while continuing to pump out cheap and easy bugs.  Sure, your outpost would be a tough egg to crack, but he'd be teching up while you'd be stuck defenseless.  Not a good place to be. 

And can you imagine a computer (that already cheats to varying degrees) being able to spam them while you have to *gasp* play by the rules?!  It'd be a bother.

Let's take a look at some early game match-ups.

If you're going fed vs dominion, the fed's destroyers can all take the bug 1 on 1, and if you're facing Norways... well, those bugs are going to seem like the ones you know and love.

If it's rom vs dom, you're going to want to tech up and leave the bugs behind.  Romulan destroyers are easily the best in the game, and will kill you.

The klingon B'rels are generally portrayed as having a similar lifespan to the bug in DS9 (that is, very short) but it's more powerful that the bug (especially with Toq'Roja) in the game.

If it's a dom vs borg game, the dominion player shouldn't even touch a bug, going straight to bombers.

All in all, the bug is weak, but it's just strong enough to support a dominion player in the early game.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 11:02 pm

Already the Dominion has exceedingly fast production, and Bugs are rather fragile yet still easily spammed. Making them any faster in terms of construction might make the Dominion early game too similar to the Klingons. 

I'd definitely disagree with saying skip the Bug when against the Borg - Bugs are close to a necessity if you fight them.

posted on December 29th, 2009, 11:54 pm

I see what your saying about Game balance vs real Trek Balance, but perhaps they could stand be to be nerfed alittle since they already build fast and are still easily spammed. Like perhaps have its weapon be strong, but its shields and hull weaker.

posted on December 30th, 2009, 12:00 am

You can always play patch 3.0.4 and below if you want the Bugs to be weaker. Of course, then, nobody really played Dominion as they were too underpowered.

posted on December 30th, 2009, 12:21 am

Hmmm... A defense of 11 is pretty low.  They were able to take a few hits in the show, as I recall.  That's how they function in game.

posted on December 30th, 2009, 3:51 am

Well, I hate strongly dislike playing against the Borg, so I guess I'm not the #1 authority on the subject.

It is possible to mod the defense to a lower value.

posted on December 30th, 2009, 3:53 am

Yep.  Bombers and bugs.  Bugs kill the engines so the bombers can fire from range and retreat before they get destroyed/assimilated.  The collision damage isn't bad, either.

posted on January 2nd, 2010, 12:34 am

Yeah.  You can keep a sphere from breaking your mining even before you can kill it by periodically ramming it to keep it from entering weapons range.  If you have enough bugs, you can get rid of the thing outright with successive rams.  Expensive, but better than losing a chunk of your income.

posted on January 2nd, 2010, 2:00 am

The last part of that advice is unacceptable in multiplayer though, keep that in mind 

posted on January 2nd, 2010, 2:54 am

Dominus you just dont like to lose.

I have a better plan. While teching up, get at least 10 c-11s with all their specials. Get a large yard and immediately start production of fighter carriers. When the sphere finaly comes. Destroy it with cascade feedback! 

posted on January 2nd, 2010, 3:42 am

  10 will kill a cube, as I recall.  You only need 5 to take on a sphere.

posted on January 2nd, 2010, 3:52 am

Only three for a Sphere 

Mmm, gotta love that 

posted on January 2nd, 2010, 4:57 am

Only three for a Sphere 

I wonder how you found that out 

posted on January 2nd, 2010, 5:08 pm

A rather short testing session with Mal ... after we wanted to figure out just how bugged the C-11's Cascade Feedback really was 

[funnystuffpictures]

posted on January 3rd, 2010, 4:25 pm

Last edited by funnystuffpictures on January 3rd, 2010, 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Good! Borg are sooooo OP! Cascade feedback makes things more balanced against them! Especialy against cubes! Borg dont deserve to win! Ever!

I think I will make a thread in the feature request, asking for the borg to be limited to 4 minners and only able to build probes, detectors, and maybe (I am very worried about this one) scubes.