Stupid strategy to use against AI - Tavara Rush

posted on October 13th, 2010, 11:43 am

Requirements: Hard AI (not tested against Merciless).  Human opponents would kill you quickly i think.  Large map, or small map with easily defensible position.  Starting moons very close to starbase.

Suggested:  Use Marge rather than Homer as she get the better Tavara and can also build 2 of them.

Overview:
Decided to try this one out just for laughs because an upgraded Tavara can take out a starbase by itself, especially if it gets a few ranks.  A veteran has no problems if you research multipurpose weapons and use it.

Strat:
You have only 1 aim, get that first Tavara out as fast as possible.  In order to do this as quick as possible you cannot think of expansion until your first Tavara is building.  This is going to give the resource advantage to the opponent, but the advantage is, while he is still building small ships, you have a beast of a ship on the board.

Part of this strat relies on your starbase defending your mining and buildings so everything needs to be close in a circle around your starbase.  Its part of the reason why it will not work against a human opponent because a human would find a good position to fire from while being safe.... however, in a team game, maybe, just maybe, you could get away with this strat, but would be at a long term disadvantage with resources..... remember guys and girls, the AI is stoopid.

So, get Di mining and research up first, then second mining and tal-shiar institute, then upgrade facility, staryard and finally the warbird yard.  You are not going to produce any other ships and you can't build the tavara until all other stations are completed, so it really doesn't make much difference in which order you build things.

One everything is built you should almost have enough resources for producing your first Tavara.  I had to wait about 20 seconds, but I was slow on my mining at the start.  While the Tavara is building you still do nothing because as soon as the Tavara is built you want to be able to hit all 3 upgrades on the Tavara... you could alternately start to produce a small ship for additional defense or research the Tavara's special and delay the upgrade.

While you have been doing this (by the way, i was playing against Borg) the AI of course will be sending ships to annoy you.  If you have built your base well then the stupid AI will send his ships into range of your starbase and losses should be null or minimal.  Worst I had to face was a few Scubes and probes that the stabase handled without upgrading.

Once your Tavara is ready upgrade it, and then its go gather experience time.  Also you should be able to start producing your second Tavara and consider making an expansion.  Tavara's are slow so expansions will probably have to be covered by Turrets or start producing some smaller ships for defense.

Your first Tavara should have no real problem dealing with what the AI is producing at this point and its just experience fodder.  Work your way to his mining expansions and deal with them for more experience.  When they are all down, and by this time your second Tavara and maybe some other ships will be ready, go for his main base.

I finished my test game with 2 Tavara and 2 Serkas without loosing a single ship.

Maybe i should try it again with either more opponents or a merciless AI.

posted on October 13th, 2010, 12:02 pm

Do you have to build the staryard to get the Tavara? I can't remember, I barely get a chance to build them.

posted on October 13th, 2010, 12:10 pm

you need all three research stations for tavara, and i think at least 1 of them needs staryard, so u really do need every building

Maybe you could get away with not buying the upgrades immediately in order to get the second tavara building.

Any human would kill you long before this lol, but for comp stomping it may be fun

posted on October 13th, 2010, 12:41 pm

Maybe you could get away with not buying the upgrades immediately in order to get the second tavara building.

Yes, probably an earlier second Tavara is more useful than 1 fully upgraded one and a later second one.  You can always upgrade the first one while it is cruising around attacking weaker targets.  My main worry is that I would get swamped by the AI if i had a weaker tavara but that didn't happen.

posted on October 13th, 2010, 8:24 pm

well u could upgrade with all your money after the second tavara starts building.

plus tavara ranks pretty good. the only one which is really useful early is the super cloak

advanced cloak with 1 second time. no chance of dying.

[funnystuffpictures]

posted on October 16th, 2010, 3:21 pm

Last edited by funnystuffpictures on October 16th, 2010, 3:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

This is how I usually rush a Tavara against the ai in 10 simple steps.

1. Chose a large map such as Confront (48000x48000)

2. Set the ai as far away from you as possible.

3. Set up mining and expansion

4. Start building research

5. If any ai attack you, use the map editor and delete them

6. wait

7. wait some more while you keep building

8. The ai is expanding to fast lets delete half of their stuff and all of their construction ships.

9. Get tired of waiting and just place 15 Tavaras and Dominion Dreadnoughts the enemies base!  !!!!

10. Go get some fries and talk about how awesome it was

posted on October 16th, 2010, 5:33 pm

placing like 30 HWP via map editor to enemy base is also.. hmm beautiful 

posted on October 16th, 2010, 7:14 pm

try 50 perimeters

also if u use showmethemoney to get money u can upgrade them all and at charges will pepper the area.

posted on October 17th, 2010, 5:58 pm

Oh no, people are derailing my beautiful thread 

posted on October 17th, 2010, 6:25 pm

Oh no, people are derailing my beautiful thread 

^^Said Loki, God of Chaos.

...Sorry, just wanted to point out the irony I'm seeing there.  But on the up and up, your strategy sounds like a fun way to stomp the AI.  I'll have to give it a try when I have the time.

Regards,
-Grey

posted on October 17th, 2010, 7:57 pm

loki in the time you've been here at least 50% of your posts have been off topic, and you have derailed more threads than anyone.

posted on October 17th, 2010, 7:58 pm

Don't sell yourself short Myles, you've done your fair share of derailing! 

posted on October 18th, 2010, 2:11 am

I think we should have a derailing contest...maybe for the month of November.  Okay check that, maybe 1 week or even 3 days.  Otherwise it could get out of hand XD

posted on October 18th, 2010, 2:18 am

not really the same.. but I do this flagship squad thing. Pretty much you get to larger vessels as quickly as possible. Build maybe two - five destroyers, then right into your large shipyards while computer AI is still at destroyer phase.

Rank up maybe 9-12 warships. Destroy the AI. Works perfectly for Romulans. But I don't do just two tavaras. Tavaras, Norexan, D, and Cehlears. A few each. Set the AI to hard in ship build time, and easier setting with ship build cost. They'll send you so many ships as long as you survive the initial attacks, your big birds will rank up crazy fast. Get Veterans easily, and then  you are pretty much unstoppable. Also, I push up the weapons damage in my favour, so that my starbases can do the damage in the beginning I need them too. Not 2.0, I think like 1.3-1.5 should do. Don't remember exactly.

Ranking up three descents, with a couple galaxies, sovereigns, and a few defiants is also fun.

posted on October 18th, 2010, 4:50 am

loki in the time you've been here at least 50% of your posts have been off topic, and you have derailed more threads than anyone.

Its why the forum statistics for the previous month were so high! 

Last night tried the tactic against a Merciless AI (Dominion)... oh boy, that was bad.  I held the AI off until I got my first Tavara out but by then the never-ending waves of ships were really coming in.  I got 2 Tavaras out fully upgraded with 2 gold bars (one converted to veteran) and statbase fully upgraded.

It was a complete stalemate.  I couldn't move my Tavaras away from the starbase and shipyards otherwise they would get raped and new ships were getting blown up as soon as they exited the shipyard (seriously!).  It was just constant action for 15 minutes.  In the end I just quit.  Still, it showed just how powerful tavaras are when they can survive that sort of onslaught without backup.

Anyway, must get back playing online and stop messing around with the AI.