Blank FO?

posted on September 1st, 2010, 1:17 am

I would like to see a mostly empty version of FO released with little more than the engine and perhaps a few of the maps. No unnecessary odfs, vessel/station textures, vessel/station sods, etc. Basically, a blank canvas for modders to use that utilizes the Fleet Ops engine and features. This would allow modders to make their own mod using the FO engine without having to remove all of the FO stuff, making it much less intimidating. Also, then people wouldn't have to download and install a 1.44GB game just so they can use the new features. I also think that this would be a good replacement for the Patch Project because you would basically just have to strip out the unnecessary files from Fleet Ops rather than work on a whole second project while achieving almost the same effect.

So, devs, what do you think?

posted on September 1st, 2010, 1:26 am

I would like to see a mostly empty version of FO released with little more than the engine and perhaps a few of the maps. No unnecessary odfs, vessel/station textures, vessel/station sods, etc. Basically, a blank canvas for modders to use that utilizes the Fleet Ops engine and features. This would allow modders to make their own mod using the FO engine without having to remove all of the FO stuff, making it much less intimidating. Also, then people wouldn't have to download and install a 1.44GB game just so they can use the new features. I also think that this would be a good replacement for the Patch Project because you would basically just have to strip out the unnecessary files from Fleet Ops rather than work on a whole second project while achieving almost the same effect.

So, devs, what do you think?

I don't know what the Devs would say, but I can tell you from my own personal exsperiences that what you are suggesting would then be harder for those that are new to the game (and there are a few people that seem to be joining the Armada II Community). These people would most likely find it easier to have something lke the Patch Project to use for their games that some empty version of Fleet Ops. I know I don't speak for everyone, but that is my belief and that would also be harder for completeing certain mods because to do what your saying I think that everyone using your method (if the Devs released something like that) would confuse many people and they might leave the community. By any cahcne do I have this right Devs or am I not fully right?

To defend the Patch Project though, I'd say for those that are new to the game, they have the Patch Project to fix all to almost all of the errors that are in the game that the Official 1.1 Patch didn't fix and the errors Activison don't care about.

posted on September 1st, 2010, 1:47 am

I can see what you're saying, but my idea was more for the experienced modders to be able to use the FO features without the game itself getting in the way than a way for new modders to start off. It was also to skirt the issue of the team not currently having the time or man-power to develop both the Patch Project and Fleet Ops at the same time.

posted on September 1st, 2010, 2:48 am

If no one else takes up the job I might consider working on finding out what files are safe to delete and maybe making a "Blank Canvas FO" for modders to use. I'm in support of this idea, I have a feeling though that the devs would rather focus on getting more stuff done first though.

posted on September 1st, 2010, 7:42 am

A couple of patches ago I was quite into modding FO myself. A "clean" FO or to better say a "Blank Canvas FO" could indeed be very helpful to experienced modders who don't want to put in most of the things FO offers right now anyway. I'm thinking of total conversions here in the first place.

If you, TUN, would support him or start the work I suppose it would be for the benefit of us all since the majority here might want the devs to put more stuff in instead of "cleaning up" their mod 

So, yeah, I second cabal's idea 

posted on September 1st, 2010, 10:11 am

i guess a keen modder could install stock fo then strip out the bits they dont need. then zip it up and ask the devs to host it if they think its worthwhile. but it wont have an installer lol.

posted on September 1st, 2010, 11:26 am

i think that there are very few people who could really take advantage of such a version. how many modders do exist that are experienced enough to create a total conversion from scratch? for new modders it might be confusing to throw a blank version at them which they have to create or add all content before they even can start the game. we all started modding by looking at a complete game, not a stripped version.
besides that i feel such a 'blank fo' is not necessary, there are also technical aspects and of course limited time that makes it complicated to provide such a stripped version.
sure, if you want to release a total conversion based on fleet operations' base files, we can talk about that.

posted on September 1st, 2010, 2:01 pm

Well, this kinda spawn from MSFC because many people there seem to not like FO.(Who knew?)  It seemed that a few of them didn't want to mod FO because in its current state it was confusing, and they didn't like how FO was gameplay wise, but wanted to utilize its coding features.  I suggested that maybe they would try it if somebody who knew what they were doing could strip out all the game, and either leave it blank, or insert a stock like environment  They would only consider this if there was a good guide to go with it, and when I directed them to the WIP modding guide, they thought it might actually be a good idea.  Its true there were only a few, and originally, I was just gonna take out all the ship and station odfs, textures and SOD's and just let them start from scratch, but Dominus suggested that we might ask you guys. I think it would bring a few more modders into the fold, and they could recommend it to others, and the guide would become even more popular than it is.


It just seems that experienced modders who are use to stock a2, thought a patch project was much better, and FO is completely different.  Even though most mods still work in FO with minor adjustment, It seems like a completely different game.  A blank FO would be like the easy way of making a new patch project, without having to go to all the work of extracting the coding.


Oh, and though there weren't very many, there were still about 5 people at MSFC who openly said this was wither a good idea, or something they would use in the future.  And these were experienced modders aswell.  The kinda people who would significantly strengthen the modding community around FO because they have been around so long.



If the devs aren't interested in doing something like it, then would it be within the guidelines to make some kind of patcher that would just delete the odfs or something out of FO?  It would still require a full install of FO in the first place, I would just have to decide what people don't want, and what people would, like examples of weapons or something.

posted on September 1st, 2010, 6:54 pm

Yea, that would be quite a bit of work, and I don't see why I should invest time for 5 people who dont realy want it, while there is an FO Modding community which is lurking for new tools the whole day! (yep consider this a small mini anouncement )

posted on September 1st, 2010, 7:03 pm

Tis true...  Unfortunately, there are just not many FO modders atm compared to those for stock.  We were trying to bridge the gap between FO and the PP as people are reluctant to mod a "completely different game" which we were trying to explain  otherwise.  A blank FO would just help some convert their current mods to FO because they wouldn't have to weed through all the unknown, and just add the FO features back in as they wanted.

and I wouldn't call it lurking   I am quite openly excited with the...leaked...news *points fingers at Bird-Face* 

Can't wait.   Though, I still need to know.  Would you be against somebody doing something like that on their own?  I was originally just gonna make a patcher for FO that could cut out what people didn't want.  Would you be apposed to this devs?

posted on September 1st, 2010, 7:06 pm

True.
And if I was to restart my personal FO mod I wouldn't expect a blank FO as a basis. I would work with the "full version" again. So, whoever really wants to mod FO can do it already when even I could do that back then.  :lol: So don't waste your time, devs  :thumbsup:

[jetnova16]

posted on September 2nd, 2010, 2:07 am

Last edited by jetnova16 on September 2nd, 2010, 2:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

Well, this kinda spawn from MSFC because many people there seem to not like FO.(Who knew?)  It seemed that a few of them didn't want to mod FO because in its current state it was confusing, and they didn't like how FO was gameplay wise, but wanted to utilize its coding features.  I suggested that maybe they would try it if somebody who knew what they were doing could strip out all the game, and either leave it blank, or insert a stock like environment  They would only consider this if there was a good guide to go with it, and when I directed them to the WIP modding guide, they thought it might actually be a good idea.  Its true there were only a few, and originally, I was just gonna take out all the ship and station odfs, textures and SOD's and just let them start from scratch, but Dominus suggested that we might ask you guys. I think it would bring a few more modders into the fold, and they could recommend it to others, and the guide would become even more popular than it is.


It just seems that experienced modders who are use to stock a2, thought a patch project was much better, and FO is completely different.  Even though most mods still work in FO with minor adjustment, It seems like a completely different game.  A blank FO would be like the easy way of making a new patch project, without having to go to all the work of extracting the coding.


Oh, and though there weren't very many, there were still about 5 people at MSFC who openly said this was wither a good idea, or something they would use in the future.  And these were experienced modders aswell.  The kinda people who would significantly strengthen the modding community around FO because they have been around so long.



If the devs aren't interested in doing something like it, then would it be within the guidelines to make some kind of patcher that would just delete the odfs or something out of FO?  It would still require a full install of FO in the first place, I would just have to decide what people don't want, and what people would, like examples of weapons or something.

Well, this kinda spawn from MSFC because many people there seem to not like FO.(Who knew?)

I knew actually and I mentioned it in another thread, it wasn't to be rude or anything, it was to inform. I've seen the same thing at Armada2Files with people not liking Fleet Ops. I happened to want to believe them and thus stayed away from it, but then some POTD's got me interested so I have to admit I have a saved download file for the installation of the latest Fleet Ops and in fact the ships I liked I've found away to transfer over to Armada II for that purpose. Fleet Ops is pretty cool and I'm actually just waiting for a campaign version before I officially play it because all I can do is play against the AI in Instant Action since I have a hard time getting an internet connection, I can't play online.

posted on September 6th, 2010, 10:45 am

If a blank FO, or a version that replaced the races of FO with stock A2 odf files and models became available I would consider porting Yesteryears to it after I finished the mod on the stock platform.

But considering the amount of people here whom are against it like the amount of people elsewhere whom aren't fans of FO I can't see this happening.

posted on September 6th, 2010, 2:36 pm

If a blank FO, or a version that replaced the races of FO with stock A2 odf files and models became available I would consider porting Yesteryears to it after I finished the mod on the stock platform.

But considering the amount of people here whom are against it like the amount of people elsewhere whom aren't fans of FO I can't see this happening.

You should look into Apoclaydon / Blade's A2 to FO total conversion. Not everything is ported, but nearly everything (in 3.1.4 everything will be able to be if he continues to keep working on that) .

posted on September 6th, 2010, 7:30 pm

You should look into Apoclaydon / Blade's A2 to FO total conversion. Not everything is ported, but nearly everything (in 3.1.4 everything will be able to be if he continues to keep working on that) .

I think I keep getting more and more into Fleet Ops and that I might actually reinstall a version to actually play until the one with the campaign is ever released/made. 

I do got a question though, I have gotten  just gotten Star Trek Armada I from my friend to install on my laptop and its taking over 3 hours, the first time something went wrong that I had to uninstall it and reinstall it again (I think its because my laptop's battery was about to die and the computer went to sleep mode.)

Also where are the odf files in Star Trek Armada I located if I wanted to edit them?

Also lastly is it possible for combing Armada I missions with Armada II?