starting with 2 scouts

posted on December 15th, 2010, 5:15 pm

Is that such a bad thing?  The build orders will have to change eventually anyway when they redo how proxy yarding works.

I wouldn't mind FO being less about rushing to see what your opponent is building, then building the hard counter to that unit.

The problem is that it would become insanely difficult to balance Fleet Ops in its current system if scouts were removed from initial setup, as well make it almost impossible to stop a rush. Whoever builds the scout would in fact most likely have the disadvantage because they'd have to spend more money, tie up their build queue and not be able to expand, AND in most cases reveal to their opponent who their enemy actually is (thereby allowing the enemy to gain a tactical and economic advantage by guessing what strategy to use). Except for the cloaking races of course - those would just become insanely powerful because of that. Not to mention this change would make every faction's baseline strategy the best strategy to use in the vast majority of cases.

posted on December 15th, 2010, 5:26 pm

I have to agree with Dom about the question of "not beginning with a scout".


  If it helps, you can compare FleetOps to Starcraft 2 gameplay as it's another great RTS with some very distinct gameplay differences.

  In SC2, you have to build up your base from the ground up essentially, so you have time to scout with one of your many workers.  In Flops, your workers (Builders/Miners) are nothing like that and are slow.

  In SC2, the gameplay is more rapid and things easier to destroy as a whole.  The total distribution of hitpoints is much less in SC2 so losing a few units early on isn't always the biggest deal, while losing your first few destroyers in Flops can spell disaster.

  The Scout is very important as it's the only way you can tell what kind of vessels your enemy is going to head towards .

posted on December 15th, 2010, 5:43 pm

I would like two scouts at the start.  One could be used for spying, the other would be used to find expansions.  The scouts power doesn't need to be lowered.

And I would also like the Federation scout equipped with a device to encase itself in a subspace bubble, hiding it from sight and sensors.  Tachyon detection systems would be useless.

Equip the Borg scout with a strong shield to prevent transport.

posted on December 15th, 2010, 5:44 pm

to posts saying borg scout (detector) is weak:

yea, Borg Scouting is SOOO op, borg have shit sensor without sensor upgrade, borg scout is the only thing that helps support borg sensor early game. also borg detector has lost power over the patches first it was 3 damage now 1 and now you want it to do .5 or even 0 damage? >.>;

/end rant


but seriously if you use scouts the smart way you only need one as build times for ships and stations take a while and scouts only need 10 to 30 seconds to move between enemy bases (since they are usually close together)

- also for cloakers --> put scout on green alert and use p + tab to put a patrol route  (this also works with non-cloakers if you are careful)

posted on December 15th, 2010, 7:46 pm

While we're on the subject of increasing the amount of starting units (in this case scouts) can someone from the developers tell us why the borg start with only a single constructor.

posted on December 15th, 2010, 7:54 pm

Probably either to be unique or because they don't have enough stations to justify 2 of them. All they have is 2 research stations, a supply centre and a very fast building 'shipyard' and don't have anything to do with expansions except for the Dodecs.

1 Constructor can build the main stations and then spam Collective Uplinks.

posted on December 15th, 2010, 8:00 pm

The guide says that one is all the Borg need.

posted on December 15th, 2010, 8:28 pm

You'll basically only need a second constructor late in game if you want to build a second base, or start massing Incub Centers and Uplinks. Early in game their construction system works well enough that your one constructor can easily build everything with no construction delays.