Starbase upgrades

posted on November 5th, 2011, 3:04 pm

I thought about the late game where you and your enemy`s have a large fleet at hand.
You don't want to split your forces in two because you would have no chance by running into an enemy with
full forces. So you have 1 star base at your main perhaps another on crucial point of entrance. But even if the
star base is upgraded there would be no chance of holding off the enemy fleet long enough till your arrival.
If your fleet is there nothing else would.

So this is just an example. Please put not to much weight into it. So my proposal is a third upgrade for the star base.
It would be the fighters from the carriers.
It should be available if all yards are build (depending on the species)
2000 tritanium 2000 dilitium 100 supply's maybe - This it not to much considering the ability you gain.

(excuse my grammar)

posted on November 5th, 2011, 4:22 pm

Fighters for Starbase as final upgrade. Could be interesting.

While on the subject, perhaps other upgrades for starbases can be interesting.
* Repair teams/beams Dogfight range
* Graviton catapult - Memory Alpha, the Star Trek Wiki
* Toned down Vector Calculation
* Fleet Supply
* Choose Ability: High Density Shield generators, ADAI, EPS Control Nodes, Fast Tracking Computers, Ablative Armor Plates. Each adds a bonus against a certain ship type and adds a weakness to other types.
* Medical Facilities: Replenish crew

posted on November 5th, 2011, 5:18 pm

Fighters could be interesting.  I was thinking maybe one could do research to make turrets more cost-effective in late-game.  Either by increasing the weapon effectiveness (not defenses) or by making them cheaper.  The other alternative that I just thought of, is that one could build a couple of extra yards and have them build the early-game destroyers as a support fleet.  But games almost never get to the point where the opponent is destroying the enemy base.  Large matches get one or two bases destroyed, then the match is called.

Having something to help increase the defenses of the base could be very beneficial late game to add another element to deal with.  Also, (if we could program the "currency" resource) trading would be very beneficial to gameplay to add an element of uncertainty to the game.

posted on November 5th, 2011, 6:22 pm

another possibility would be the avatar bonus for the star base so it can level like a star ship.
Of course it should take longer to level a star base. Giving it the "B" (the highest level upgrade thingy)  ^^

"Best ideas came on WC in a bathroom where i cant wright them down" darn

[godsvoice]

posted on November 5th, 2011, 7:46 pm

Last edited by godsvoice on November 5th, 2011, 7:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I think that at some point star bases should become weak in the game though.

I mean, are you saying that the starbase should be upgradable ad nauseum throughout the game?
(I know you are not explicitly saying this, but there could always be a suggestion given to give star bases one more upgrade, even after this one, if it is accepted)

At some point a large enough fleet of your enemy should be able to just crush it.

If I have 30 ships, all those researched specials, the ranks I have earned, I sort of expect that I should be able to defeat a star base with minimal losses... say 5 or so, depending on how many turrets might be around.

I'm not saying one final upgrade would be bad, but your just extending the game. Late game is no longer a problem with that upgrade. But now you've created a new stage in the game. The late late game, where one or both sides is now just so powerful that even those upgrades don't matter because you can afford not only 1 full fleet, but 2 3 or 4 full fleets.

Eventually, the star base has to stop being upgraded... it should never be powerful enough to defeat 30 ships in my view. Maybe a dozen is fair though.

But, in the interest of making this upgrades give your fleet a chance to come back and defeat the enemy fleet I'm ok with it. If these upgrades make it that it takes 67 seconds to destroy a star base, instead of 45 seconds... that is not so bad, but not that star bases are suddenly able to defeat hoards of ships.

I dunno, those are just my first thoughts on the matter.

Edit: Condensed: I don't mind this, so long as I still can destroy the starbase, just that it takes slightly longer so you have more time to bring your fleet back. But I don't want it if it allows starbases to destroy large numbers of ships. 30 ships should be a guaranteed starbase destroyer.

posted on November 5th, 2011, 7:53 pm

How about just have the starbase rank up during battle, but no additional upgrades.

posted on November 5th, 2011, 9:45 pm

Starbases are fine. Finish off the enemy before they hav thirty midgame ships.

posted on November 6th, 2011, 12:19 am

in the early game you consider twice if and when you attack the enemy
star base but later on you can just fly by and kill.

it should be a tactical matter. At the moment tactic is less important
in the late game. You just need good macro.


I agree with you "godsvoice" Defending an entire fleet is not the
task of a star base but that was not the intention of my idea.

I also like the idea of ranking up the star base

[godsvoice]

posted on November 6th, 2011, 3:44 am

Last edited by godsvoice on November 6th, 2011, 3:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

Yes, I know it's not what you meant. I didn't mean to imply it was.

Just that, if we keep making starbases stronger and stronger... problems might arise.

So, yes, the idea isn't to bad to make it something like DS9, where instead of a defiant like warship, you have smaller fighters to send out.

But just in general.

Currently the upgrades are two upgrades of 600 / 50, and 50 / 600. This brings star bases from a start point of something like 50 offensive, to 110 offensive and even greater for defensive.

If you make this cost 2000 di, that is more than both of those offensive upgrades combined, which was 1200. And almost as much for the defensive which was 1200, but you are saying 1000. So for that price, I could either build myself a second starbase, or I would want that upgrade to do some major major damage.

My alternative suggestion, if this goes somewhere, is maybe make the cost 750 / 300, and make it equivalent to having a starbase and a minor turret at the location. Might need to work out some kinks, do ships auto target the fighters now? They shouldn't. I would want the starbase to always be targeted. And, the fighters can maybe do enough damage to one ship, even though the starbase generally targets several at a time. The fighters help to finish off the weakest one.

Edit: So gives it some extra fire power, but doesn't really boost the defensive that much. So, you might save some time if you can kill a few ships faster and lower the enemy's dps.

posted on November 6th, 2011, 8:16 am

It would be cool if starbases were able to kill a single ship when facing a fleet. Due to autotargeting you usually don't even get a single one, though. At east not when they have a fleet of about 10. With Feds/Borg even less.

posted on November 6th, 2011, 10:08 am

I like the idea of ranks and fighter upgrades for the starbase.

The fighters could support the starbase a little better and would give some covering for it while the ranks would be nice to have. But I think you will only see ranks vs. the AI - a sane player would'nt lose a ship against a starbase - only if he goes for the final strike.

I think a good mix will do the thing. What I think there should be is a little more offensive power for the starbases. Up to now, I feel that there is no real danger from a starbase, because you can rush in, kill a miner and get out before you are in danger. The starbase fullfills in my eyes mor of a "safe region" for early and mid game", but with its offense power now, even a destroyer can more or less do a safe hit and run attack in the "safe zone". You should feel the pain, if you go into this zone. So a little more offense, like +50 in the base stats may do the trick.

posted on November 6th, 2011, 2:45 pm

I would love to see fighters as a final 4th upgrade, that would be pretty cool.

posted on November 7th, 2011, 2:55 pm

No to fighter upgrades for every race, but more unique and additional upgrades sound nice.

Like Borg having a upgradeable assim holding beam, Dom and Fed maybe Fighters later, Rom maybe additional damage and range (!).

Anyways, the idea is nice.

posted on November 7th, 2011, 3:53 pm

I'd agree with beserene on this; the last upgrade type should be something unique to that race.

It's true that successful use of fighters by one race would lead to other races developing them too, but we'd run the risk of making the races too "cookie cutter"-ish; so to keep variety, I'd say keep fighters to one or two races, and give the others something just as cool but different.

posted on November 7th, 2011, 4:06 pm

Currently, only the Dominion and Risner-Federation use fighters, so one of those with Fighters on a Starbase shouldn't be a problem.