Sovereign Nemesis Ability

posted on March 22nd, 2013, 10:03 am

In one of my mods I have kind of a 'rapid-fire multiple target auxiliary phaser array'. Basically the weapon fires a set of light phaser strikes on multiple enemy targets from various hardpoints, using the 'shotdelay0,1,2,3' ect. command line although mine isn't set up for cloak penetration or anything just for hitting multiple targets in sequence. To me it looks better than just a 'multi-targeting phaser'

posted on March 22nd, 2013, 2:32 pm

I have a lot of experience with MultiTargeting Phasers. Its been one of the core features of the Starfleet side of my personal mod for years. The trick is that you have to have a lot of hardpoints on a given vessel because if you don't youll have like 5 phaser beams coming from one spot. That looks awful. The main dorsal phaser on my Sovvy has about 60-70 hp alone. that means that you won't have five beams coming out of one hardpoint.. you may have five individual beams firing at five separate targets. also the hardpoint rotation coding in FLOPS forces the game to switch hardpoints for firing giving it a much better look like the shows and movies...

The Zero Elevation firing pattern displayed by the Enterprise is prevalent on all Federation vessels that carry phaser arrays.. even ships as small as a Saber class can do it... those vessels have a lower percentage of hitting targets because of older targetting systems that aren't as accurate. no bioneral gelpacks etc. But they can do it. It takes a lot of energy to do it as well. And that screen cap is not an accurate representation of what actually happened in the movie.. you have to watch the scene entirely..you see the enterprise fire forward and the proceed to both port and starboard back toward aft.. once the phasers impacted the shields of the Scimitar after torpedos fired...unfortuantely the Scimitar was too fast fo rthe Enterprise to get any direct torpedo hits.

posted on March 22nd, 2013, 3:22 pm

Hello I woudl like to comemnt on that no one would ever use that tactic to find an enemy which would use to much enemy.
for the first part. the original series remember episode 9 banalce of terror? the enterprise fired torps like depth charges and some phasers here and there to discover a cloaked romulan ship. now about the energy use, from what I understand using those many phasers would mean they would be less as powerfull meaning they would use less energy being spread out like that. it dont mean they are all the same strenth that would not make any sense they would not be able to fire that fast, regardless of the speed just firing that many would mean each of them being fired at once would not consume the same amount of power and or do the same amount of damage as charging a phaser and focus directing it. I hope this makes sense it is hard for me to type at the moment.

posted on March 22nd, 2013, 5:13 pm

on the idea of wide beam phasers. tos is tos. plenty of insane stuff happened in tos. also tech changed a lot between tos and tng, so new rules may apply.

wide beam in tng is limited to personnel phasers. it's never been shown used on a starship scale. phasers have limited range, presumably because as you increase range, the beam gets weaker (like light). a personnel phaser was used to attack a room. let's assume that's a sphere of radius at most 500 times the length of the phaser itself. a ship's phaser would need to sweep a vastly larger sphere. and it would need enough power to not be instantly absorbed by the cloak or hull plating. otherwise simple light sources could reveal cloaked ships. a necessary amount of energy has to be used or the beam will be affected by the cloaking field just like light is. sweeping all of space is silly, as there would have to be a fixed range at which this stopped working (which i'd bet is under 100km - nothing for spaceships) or you could phaser sweep the entire galaxy.

posted on March 22nd, 2013, 5:33 pm

Ship Phasers stunning a city block wouldn't be the first forgotten ability in the show, like the Borg shields that deflected physical assaults back in BoBW.

posted on March 23rd, 2013, 5:59 pm

If I remember my game lore correctly phasers are effective out to 300,000km. There is no reason that they still couldn't do the wide setting on their phasers. Saying it doesn't exist because they didn't show it in every series is not an argument. That is like saying that the salt sucker or the rock aliens from TOS no longer exist because they never showed them in TNG.

The one argument that really goes against it is that it was never used in ANY of the series for looking for cloaked ships. Off hand I remember them blowing up some cargo to find a bird of prey, using tachyon grid stuff, the random firing of torpedoes and phasers that we saw in TOS, something to do with background radiation making a cloaked ship detectable and probably some others that I am forgetting. Now that is an argument against it for whatever reason, drains ships power to quickly, cloaks absorb etc.

Of course I have long wondered why they didn't just use stun fields on sections of ships when they get boarded or have holo emitters that could spawn limitless numbers of troops when defending areas like that Dominion super computer on the ground battle episode. But that requires some thinking outside the box. Although I will give the writers of that episode mega kudos for the subspace randomly floating mines. That and the sticky grenade from Enterprise show that at least some of the writers play lots of war games or watch other movies and shows besides just Star Trek.

posted on March 23rd, 2013, 7:01 pm

If I remember my game lore correctly phasers are effective out to 300,000km.

I'm talking about canon, not a game. and trying to get an exact number for the range in canon isn't going to work, canon is just too inconsistent.

There is no reason that they still couldn't do the wide setting on their phasers. Saying it doesn't exist because they didn't show it in every series is not an argument. That is like saying that the salt sucker or the rock aliens from TOS no longer exist because they never showed them in TNG.

actually tos was full of nonsense, as you'd expect for a show from the 60s. do you seriously want gary mitchell (ESP/esper ratings bullshit) or the nonsense barrier at the edge of the galaxy to come back? all of these things were left out of tng for a reason. even the writers didn't want to be dealing with some of the nonsense tos had. Luckily some of it can be handwaved away by saying that technology could have changed in the time gap. maybe phasers changed.

Of course I have long wondered why they didn't just use stun fields on sections of ships when they get boarded or have holo emitters that could spawn limitless numbers of troops when defending areas like that Dominion super computer on the ground battle episode. But that requires some thinking outside the box. Although I will give the writers of that episode mega kudos for the subspace randomly floating mines. That and the sticky grenade from Enterprise show that at least some of the writers play lots of war games or watch other movies and shows besides just Star Trek.

better internal defences i agree with you on. transporter inhibitors, that autophaser from ds9, venting atmosphere. boarding shouldn't be so easy.

holographic troops make no sense though. for one the projection systems make an easy and immobile target. secondly we've seen weapons that can disrupt an entire hologrid. holograms are pretty vulnerable. also they'd need a lot of power. at least as much as a phaser, if they were to do as much harm as a phaser.

posted on April 21st, 2013, 1:46 am

OK I could not resist but to comment on this topic because this is some thing I am all to interested in.

To start with effective range of Phasers is some thing you can not call cannon on for a few different reasons.
1 Each class of ship has it's own Phaser emitter and power source each different combanation can effect the range of a ship's Phaser shot.
Then you come to the crew factor a ship's engineer and a ships captain would adjust the ship's setting's differently making the difference all the more.

Lastly nonsense of the Original series well it is up the person to make up the choice but the writers for enterprise said it best each series has it's own races.
As in some from the Original series had gone extinct so was some from Enterprise and if we got another generation of star trek some from DS9 and Next Generation would of also been extinct.

The Writers of Star Trek just never bothered to sit down and make a list.
As for The Barrier that was not in the Next Generation the Enterprise-D went much farther across space then any of Kirk's Enterprises had gone.

Also as for internal Defenses of Federation ships.
The Enterprise-D had used force fields.
Also Federation Holographic Technology had not been all that great for most of the Next Generation and Deep Space Nine in fact there is a good chance only Voyager and the Enterprise-E where the only main star ships even equipped with holographic projectors out side of a holodeck.

Writers would always take the route of a breath taking crew vs. crew fire fight over any other intruder counter measure when it comes to on board the hero's ship as in Kirk, picard Ben, Jane-way etc...

Lastly we come to the close of this reply.
When a new episode was in production they would compromise here and there this and that for plot reasons.

posted on May 2nd, 2013, 4:55 pm

wow, this again. technically, the only reason that worked with Picard is
1) he's PICARD
2) he realised the pattern: stupid, 2D attacks.
3) Shinzon was a bit of an idiot
4) the vessel was too big to make any quick course changes, therefore it couldn't avoid the shots.
so it wouldn't fit at all in normal fleet operation.
buuuut, if you really want, I could maybe make an argument for the opposite.
Edit:

The Writers of Star Trek just never bothered to sit down and make a list.
As for The Barrier that was not in the Next Generation the Enterprise-D went much farther across space then any of Kirk's Enterprises had gone. note: they said the edge of the galaxy, they didn't say which edge, it could have been top/bottom. and the Barrier in "undiscovered country" could been made by that god or it endded up being so easy to cross that they didn't care anymore.

Also as for internal Defenses of Federation ships.
The Enterprise-D had used force fields.
Also Federation Holographic Technology had not been all that great for most of the Next Generation and Deep Space Nine in fact there is a good chance only Voyager and the Enterprise-E where the only main star ships even equipped with holographic projectors out side of a holodeck. So did the Prometheus, and Dr. Zimmerman did say that he was revamping the program so that it would go on long range missions, I have a feeling he mean taht a bit later, every ship would have one

Writers would always take the route of a breath taking crew vs. crew fire fight over any other intruder counter measure when it comes to on board the hero's ship as in Kirk, picard Ben, Jane-way etc... true

Lastly we come to the close of this reply.
When a new episode was in production they would compromise here and there this and that for plot reasons. true

its a common misconception that the tech in ST is static; in fact, half the episodes in TNG were probably about "developing superior warp coils" or "making a new cloak" or "creating this and that rays" or "enhancing the warp/impulse drives/ weapons/scanners". in fact, it's constantly evolving. eg: the tricorders in DS9 were capable of scanning DNA, those in TNG couldn't. holograms about as evolved dramatically from the first episode of TNG to Voyager as the developments in AI over the last 10 years (from landscapes to medical holograms with complete personalities). imagine you're an alien seeing the battleships from 30 years ago and the battleships now, they might have a completely different system but still look the same on the surface. (the metaphasic shielding that Ent D had in S.7 E.1, completely different from the shields S.1 E.1.

posted on May 2nd, 2013, 6:13 pm

A 2D attack would fit into FO because FO is just as 2D as any movie battle, with pilots as stupid as any canon ones.

posted on May 4th, 2013, 12:00 am

its a common misconception that the tech in ST is static; in fact, half the episodes in TNG were probably about "developing superior warp coils" or "making a new cloak" or "creating this and that rays" or "enhancing the warp/impulse drives/ weapons/scanners".

Heh, there was even a fantastic example in All Good Things (paraphrasing):

Farpoint era-

Data: "We would need a tomographic imaging scanner to look properly at this."
Picard: "Do we have one?"
Data: "No, they are still in developemt."

Picard's PoV flashes forward.

Picard: "Do we have a tomographic imaging scanner aboard?"
Data: "Yes."

posted on May 19th, 2013, 8:37 am

I'm sorry but I didn't read all the posts. ^^' Just to much stuff.

Anyway - Maybe this ability should be only for ships with phaser banks that has been made special for multi targeting.

Similar to the XY-Type Phasers that fire 2 beams, they could fire 4 shots per volley. Every beam will hit another target on the enemy vessel and there is a chance that one hit damages/disables a system.
To keep the balance this phasers use special weapon energy for the extra shots (like the Excelsior uses the energy to launch extra photon torpedo's )

Using this phasers for "detecting" a cloaked enemy unit would be a nice secondary way to use them.
Maybe there is a "multi target" ability that is changed to "detecting" if no visible enemy is in weapons range?

Just some ideas...