Sovereign Nemesis Ability

Post ideas and suggestions on new features or improvements here.
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posted on March 21st, 2013, 2:00 pm
Since I hear the Sovereign class will be at least partially redone for next patch, I was wondering if the developers are considering implementing the Enterprise's 360 degree phaser spread ability displayed in Nemesis. I believe Picard called it a full phaser spread at zero elevation. This could be used as a form of damaging cloak detect and could make mid-fleet combat cloak detect more viable for Federation fleets. It could either work as is or also be followed up by a torpedo volley on a single detected ship like in Nemesis to make it a punishing ability for detecting cloaked starships or destroying starships that try to cloak out.

Overall I think it would add a new dimension to the Sovereign class and can be used either as the Sovereign's main ability or as a veteran ability if the Sovereign is already receiving some pattern related ability like command patterns or something. Let me know what you guys think.
posted on March 21st, 2013, 3:42 pm
I believe Picard's exact line was: "Full axis rotation to port! Fire all ventral phasers!"

I got it from the movie directly, but here is also a link to a transcript of the movie: http://www.chakoteya.net/movies/movie10.html.

I believe it was to be a tactic to help discover cloaked vessels and then to be quickly followed up by a spread of torpedoes to do serious damage to a cloaked vessels since its shields are usually down (don't think this seems to have applied to the Scimitar though).

I believe that these phasers though are connected to the ventral side of the ship.
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Ventral
During Shinzon's attack on the USS Enterprise-E in 2379, all ventral phasers were fired in a single maneuver. In addition, the starship's ventral shielding failed on deck 29 as the result of a focused attack. (Star Trek Nemesis)

(See link for full text, its a short article)

Another quote from this link: http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Phaser_array
The later Sovereign-class starships originally had twelve arrays, including seven dorsal arrays and five ventral arrays. (Star Trek: First Contact) By 2379, four additional arrays were added to the nacelle pylons of the Sovereign-class USS Enterprise-E, bringing the total complement of arrays to sixteen. (Star Trek Nemesis)
posted on March 21st, 2013, 3:47 pm
You are right my mistake. What do you think about it as a Sovereign class ability?

EDIT: Read the transcript and I think I'm right. This is what I was referring to.

PICARD: Report.
RIKER: He's firing through the cloak. We can't get a lock.
LAFORGE: He hit our warp drive with his first shot. We've only got impulse, Captain.
PICARD: Mister Worf, prepare a full phaser spread, zero elevation. All banks on my mark. Scan for shield impacts. Stand by photon torpedoes.
WORF: Aye sir.
PICARD: Fire!
(the Scimitar cloaks again)
posted on March 21st, 2013, 3:57 pm
Seems like something that any Phaser-armed ship could do, it sounds like a good synergy ability.
posted on March 21st, 2013, 4:02 pm
Haven't gotten to build any FleetOps so I can't like or dislike their ability yet. I still like and miss the Corbomite Reflector from A2 for the Sovereign-class.

As for All Ventral Phasers, I'd guess they normally are like your standard phaser array and having nothing special to them. In my opinion, they work like Multi-Targetting Phaser Arrays that from a mod that made them for A2 and that I use in my STA2_Generational Mod they target all nearby vessels including those under cloak, they originally came on phaser turrets but I've equipped them to almost all my Federation starships as an extra phaser array using the same arrays as all phaser hp's of the ships because in my opinion, certain ship classes should have such a phaser included.
These phasers original came in this mod: http://armada2.filefront.com/file/Beta_Construction_Ship;97212

Like Tyler says, any phaser-armed ship should be able to do it.

It'd be nicer to see it done as a way to detect cloaked ships (especially stronger ones) that if it detects any and the ship using the weapon has torpedo tubes in that area that can be fired, that after discovery it fires a torpedo spread at the discovered cloaked target, that would be a good special weapon effect using the Nemesis idea. Agreed?
posted on March 21st, 2013, 4:30 pm
That type of phaser spread is actually the same thing, and it isn't just unique to the Sovereign-class but ships such as the Galaxy-class. Ships that usually have phaser strips for their arrays can do it, it just takes more power to do so it isn't done that often.

Plus if this is what you're talking about, it doesn't look like all phaser banks firing, it's only 3:
Image

Still a good idea, just not unique to the Sovereign-class.
posted on March 21st, 2013, 4:37 pm
op is right, the tactic was a zero elevation spread.

what i don't agree with op on is adding it to fleetops. it was one of the more moronic parts of nemesis (and nemesis had plenty of stupid to go around). even if one assumes a perfect coverage at zero elevation, that leaves all other elevations untouched. all the enemy needs to do is avoid sitting on that disc. i can't believe it worked in the movie, shinzon's strategy was on the level of a 12 year old. i don't want it for any ship.
posted on March 21st, 2013, 5:35 pm
To address the issue of any ship being able to perform this move, it's a possibility that only larger ships such as the Sovereign or the Galaxy have the number of phaser emitters and power necessary to perform such a maneuver.

Also, while I agree the the zero elevation issue is very unrealistic, I think a multi-elevation 360 degree phaser spread with a chance (not 100%) to reveal enemy targets, followed up by a torpedo volley on a located ship could still be a good Sovereign class ability. It would make the Sovereign more useful and give it the ability to potentially negate cloak out tactics. Would be interested to hear what more people think.
posted on March 21st, 2013, 6:21 pm
It does sound interesting, and it would make more sense than the Sovvy being able to remotely disable engines. Maybe it could be a secondary mode where it divides it's firepower among all available targets, like how the quantum turret works.
posted on March 21st, 2013, 6:38 pm
they already have the Sovereigns ram ability displayed in Nemesis

Image
posted on March 21st, 2013, 7:24 pm
wph1701 wrote:Also, while I agree the the zero elevation issue is very unrealistic, I think a multi-elevation 360 degree phaser spread with a chance (not 100%) to reveal enemy targets, followed up by a torpedo volley on a located ship could still be a good Sovereign class ability. It would make the Sovereign more useful and give it the ability to potentially negate cloak out tactics. Would be interested to hear what more people think.

i don't like that either. while saturating a disk with phaser fire is relatively easy, the amount of fire needed to cover a spherical firing pattern would be much much bigger. stupidly big even, unless it takes all day to attain coverage, in which case the enemy can move around, sitting in previously covered spots.

shooting blindly at all areas in the hopes of hitting an enemy has never been used, for good reason.
posted on March 22nd, 2013, 1:12 am
For a 360 degree "Anti-Cloak" system, photons set to burst (basically used like Depth Charges) would make far more sense. But alas, film makers go with what looks "cool" on screen
posted on March 22nd, 2013, 4:54 am
All they need to do is set their beams to very wide settings and do a sweep. The power will be so spread out that it won't actually hurt the claoked ship but it would instantly "ping" it on the sensor and then they could immediately fire on it with a normal phaser and torpedoes.

The Enterprise used wide phasers to stun an entire city in TOS and they used wide angle phasers while hunting for changelings on DS9.

This of course would only be useful at short range.

Even if they couldn't for some reason widen the angle on their ships phasers (no reason stated but lets just pretend for arguments sake) there is no reason that they couldn't use low level phasers to cover the entire 3D space around the ship in seconds. In this very day and age we have small devices that can make a 3D scan of a room in seconds. So unless they actually go backwards in technology there is no reason that they couldn't do that in the future.

Also, lasers are being used to blind pilots of aircraft today.

That being said it's the movies and it's entertainment and I just try not to think about things like this to hard otherwise it takes the enjoyment out of watching the shows.
posted on March 22nd, 2013, 5:08 am
Squire James wrote:For a 360 degree "Anti-Cloak" system, photons set to burst (basically used like Depth Charges) would make far more sense.

I like the 'torps as depth charges' idea.
posted on March 22nd, 2013, 7:12 am
@nathanj: Is there a way to implement your ideas with the phasers for a mod?
How would you suggest going about it?
I really like the "ping" idea.
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