First Starbase

[Zebh]

posted on January 26th, 2010, 5:55 pm

Last edited by Zebh on January 26th, 2010, 6:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

When game begins, the starbase you get is exactly the same as the one you can build with your construction vessel. I find that a little bit odd, as the beginning starbase in the area might have been there for who knows how long and I doubt that the faction that built it haven't updated their starbase design since. Could the beginning starbase be different to the one you can build, perhaps slightly by stats and appearance. Or perhaps totally different style. Which starbase you get in the beginning (standard one or something else) could be random.

Perhaps an older model of the starbase or modified starbase. The stats doesn't need to be much different, or different at all, but some different weapons in different starbase variants would be interesting. There could be a standard issue weaponry and 1 additional random weapon, pulse, torpedo or beam.

I also wonder, why should the beginning starbase should always be the same faction's that control it. There could be a minimal chance to get some alien starbase that the side have conquered/found/acquired other way.

The starbase built by the constructor should of course be the faction's own design.

EDIT: If the constructors build a new starbase, they will be building it in warzone. I would imagine that would affect the construction significantly. All the luxuries that the first starbase haves (holodecs, nice crew quoters, science labs etc.) would certainly be left out from the new ones, making it different to the first one.

[Tyler]

posted on January 26th, 2010, 5:59 pm

Last edited by Tyler on January 26th, 2010, 6:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The Starbases are probably done that way to be consistent with the others they build. Plus, the type Starfleet use are pretty much altered versions of what they have used in canon since at least Kirk's era. Not entirely the canon-look, but you can tell it's the same type as a Regular Research Lab without the large pod things.

Though, this is something that a one-off Spacedock could be used for.

[quaddmgtech]

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:00 pm

Last edited by quaddmgtech on January 26th, 2010, 6:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I would be a fan of having a DS-9 type station. But it is not typical for starfleet to do this (take over old alien stations) they just did it because it was a remote area near Bajor.

EDIT: Side-note to the DEVS how bout a single player 'assault' map for the campaign where the player has to either protect DS9 or take it  :whistling::rolleyes:

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:02 pm

It isn't even a Federation station. It is Bajoran, they just run it.

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:05 pm

It isn't even a Federation station. It is Bajoran, they just run it.

Well then that furthers my point 

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:25 pm

The Starbases are probably done that way to be consistent with the others they build. Plus, the type Starfleet use are pretty much altered versions of what they have used in canon since at least Kirk's era. Not entirely the canon-look, but you can tell it's the same type as a Regular Research Lab without the large pod things.

Probably very true and the consistency would certainly be a priority, but certainly there is progress made in starbase building techniques in over 100 years. In that time there most likely have been made great improvement on some of the main starbase systems (life support, energy transfer), and I would it very strange if the design used 100 years ago would be so excellent after 100 years too. Some of the new technology might be much more effective with different layout of the starbase. Also, the purpose of the starbase also affects what layout/features it haves. And the starbase that the player gets in beginnig that have been there for (more or less) long time, wouldn't necessarily serve exactly the same purpose originally designed for, and the different beginning starbase could reflect that . Terok Nor was originally a refinery.

The federation could get alien starbases too. Perhaps by acquiring abandoned one, or when a new world is in progress to be integrated to the federation. And during wartime, I doubt that starfleet wouldn't try capturing enemy's starbase in strategically important location, if the get a chance.

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:34 pm

And the starbase that the player gets in beginnig that have been there for (more or less) long time, wouldn't necessarily serve exactly the same purpose originally designed for, and the different beginning starbase could reflect that . Terok Nor was originally a refinery.

The federation could get alien starbases too. Perhaps by acquiring abandoned one, or when a new world is in progress to be integrated to the federation. And during wartime, I doubt that starfleet wouldn't try capturing enemy's starbase in strategically important location, if the get a chance.

Terok Nor was still no federation base. It was cardassian, taken by Bajorans and as Tyler said just run by Starfleet.

An alien starbase to takeover would make a good map object, but why should  a game start on it?
Also, I don't have the thought of "They must have been here for quite some time when the game begins" because if it were that way, there would also already exist mining stations around the outposts.
Why staying for long time without having evonomy establishing the whole time?

And as well as the design goes... the Regula-type outposts and variants have proven to be quite versatile and easy to refit to modern standards. The exterior may look old and aging, but the technology is still modern.

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:40 pm

Probably very true and the consistency would certainly be a priority, but certainly there is progress made in starbase building techniques in over 100 years. In that time there most likely have been made great improvement on some of the main starbase systems (life support, energy transfer), and I would it very strange if the design used 100 years ago would be so excellent after 100 years too.

Just because something is close to 100 years old, doesn't mean it isn't useful anymore given the proper re-fits. Take the Miranda and Excelsior class vessels still in service Post-TNG...

Re-fits don't necessarily change the superstructure. Something that has all new internal systems may look the same on the outside...

This is probably just Star-Fleets Shake and Bake outpost solution. Which makes sense in contested areas where you just need to establish a presence rather quickly and inexpensively. 

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:52 pm

I didn't say that would be absolutely necessary, just another possibility. And by no way I had suggest that 100 years makes something useless or unusable. Just that it wouldn't be exactly same as the brand new ones built by the constructors. And I don't think that starfleet would keep all of its starbases upgraded to the newest and the latest technologies, most likely they have been refitted with newer technology, but when the refit was, affects how new it is.

One important thing I forgot to mention: If the constructors build a new starbase, they will be building it in warzone. I would imagine that would affect the construction significantly. All the luxuries that the first starbase haves (holodecs, nice crew quoters, science labs etc.) would certainly be left out from the new ones, making it much different to the first one.

[quaddmgtech]

posted on January 26th, 2010, 6:58 pm

Last edited by quaddmgtech on January 26th, 2010, 6:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

There have been suggestions of having a more 'combat' focused station which can be deployed in more hostile areas more effectively. And I tend to support a feature like this but for Klingons and Dom's. And the dominion already have their perimeter... Which is kinda moving in that direction. But I don't think it fits with the fed style...

posted on January 26th, 2010, 7:03 pm

I suggested a general idea, not faction (federation) specific. All factions probably have starbases built in different times and later refitted. And I didn't suggest that the starbases would be much different by stats, just slightly or at all.

posted on January 26th, 2010, 7:14 pm

Hmmm ...

  I have to say I haven't really considered this idea before.    I like what you're on to though, Zebh.

  May I take it an extra step and say that perhaps you should only be able to have your actual STARBASE be the first, while subsequent are "OUTPOSTS" that perhaps cost a bit less and are 2/3 to 1/2 as powerful?  They could still build scouts, Constructors, Freighters, and perhaps even a destroyer or special unit or two, but would certainly be more of a protective Outpost than a true Starbase.


  Don't mean to hijack, but I thought I'd throw out some creativity there. 

[mimesot]

posted on January 26th, 2010, 7:56 pm

Last edited by mimesot on January 27th, 2010, 9:35 am, edited 1 time in total.

I like that idea.

And I also think that only the starting-starbases should cover a larger area with their weapons to really defend the main base.

posted on January 26th, 2010, 8:43 pm

Hmmm ...

  I have to say I haven't really considered this idea before.    I like what you're on to though, Zebh.

  May I take it an extra step and say that perhaps you should only be able to have your actual STARBASE be the first, while subsequent are "OUTPOSTS" that perhaps cost a bit less and are 2/3 to 1/2 as powerful?  They could still build scouts, Constructors, Freighters, and perhaps even a destroyer or special unit or two, but would certainly be more of a protective Outpost than a true Starbase.


   Don't mean to hijack, but I thought I'd throw out some creativity there. 

if i remember right the feds had something like this in beta2, only that the weapons were stronger if i remember right..

anyway, im all for this, but i think it should be faction specific, because

dominion has already the perimeter as strong defense
it wouldnt fit the borg playstyle
klingon i could imagine, as "glorious expansion dirctly in the cave of the lion"
feds had it already once, and i think it fits them pretty good, especially if it would serve as repair yard
rommies could maybe have funny specials in them, like cloak and a stealth field like weapon to save the miners...


just little suggestions^^

posted on January 26th, 2010, 8:52 pm

Personally, for feds and klingons I'd rather prefer the unity starbase as a mixed-tech-special.

Klingons on their own prefer using ships, not stations (the research station amount proves their lack of focusing on effective bases unless it comes to yards).
The feds on their own could have the spacedock/starbase in the beginning, but I would still prefer of using the normal outpost and getting the unity station as special (more of an impressive fortress as an alternative to the fed SFC and the klingon MoqBara-station, may be).