dominion fighters
You feel like a battlecruiser is too weak or a race too strong? Go ahead and discuss it here :)
posted on September 15th, 2009, 5:23 pm
Well I didn't say it was a fighter, just the closest Cardassian ship to one. Size is inconsistant and they have varied over the series...
posted on September 15th, 2009, 5:50 pm
Ya know, a Torpedo is a Torpedo. I kinda think that a torp launched from a fighter shouldn't be any less scary than if it was launched by a Sovvie or a Neggy. Unless it's a microtorp, in which case it should be just as scary as a microtorp from a Sang.
posted on September 15th, 2009, 6:02 pm
What about a Nano torpedo? A torpedo that can slip between the gaps of hull plates? 
Would that be scary or just plain stupid? 
Would that be scary or just plain stupid? 
posted on September 15th, 2009, 6:29 pm
Still, there is a difference: a fighter should be able to carry two torpedos at most. The "big ships" have a cargo hold that can keep what amounts to an "unlimited" amount of torpedoes. Fighters don't.silent93 wrote:Ya know, a Torpedo is a Torpedo. I kinda think that a torp launched from a fighter shouldn't be any less scary than if it was launched by a Sovvie or a Neggy. Unless it's a microtorp, in which case it should be just as scary as a microtorp from a Sang.
posted on September 15th, 2009, 8:03 pm
If one was to take the Accepted size of a fighter as being slightly larger, up to twice the size to the specfic races "work bee". We can extrapalaite size from those sources the size of a fighter payload. From the standardly Accepted cannon Federation Work bee plans . One can see that there are two last ditch armed types of the work bee . The Hornet version carried a single self contained Phaser cannon pod mounted on the port side. The Wasp version mounted a Single Photon tordedo in a pod with launch gear on the port side. So a payload of two and only two is not far off the hypothetical limit of a craft not much larger up to twice the size that a standrd work bee . So If one was to take the standard work bee base weight 2 tons and double it for its armed weight From the standard 2 metric tonnes to 4 for the base vehicle and double its weight plus additional weaponds launch package weight of two tonnes per variant type to 4 tonnes we get a vehicle of 4 tons for unarmed fighter plus 8 tons for the photon package and 8 for the phaser cannon. Doing that that gives us a total of 20 tons weight. 7.6 meters for length ,2.6meter for draft,and 4.6 meters for beam. and a crew of atleast two
posted on September 15th, 2009, 8:16 pm
Okay...... I think I see what you say. They should shrink the torp sprite? 
Or make a very long fire delay? Uhh... okay, me don't get that well.
Or make a very long fire delay? Uhh... okay, me don't get that well.
posted on September 15th, 2009, 8:19 pm
Give the fighters Special energy that doesn't recharge, with the Torps taking a certain amount?
posted on September 15th, 2009, 8:44 pm
DarthThanatos wrote:Still, there is a difference: a fighter should be able to carry two torpedos at most. The "big ships" have a cargo hold that can keep what amounts to an "unlimited" amount of torpedoes. Fighters don't.
If you remember that one DS9 episode where they go through that shrinking nebula, perhaps by then they've harnessed that technology to compress a full payload of torpedoes for them...
posted on September 16th, 2009, 4:44 am
Ok, I definately agree the fighter system needs work. I dont use the dominion fighters often (probably cause I dont play as dominion very often) But I can see that the current stats are a bit high.
I also do not like the idea of fighters that just stay out, like planting a turret. The special energy for weapons idea seems a logical fix to that, if the devs can code them to always return to the ship after depleated. This may also negate the need to have resources at all to launch the fighters, as you would not be able to spam them indefinately. I would say a supply cost at most (the fighters have to be fueled and armed right?) I also think however that the mothership should have an ability to recall all of its fighters. Im not sure how that would be worked into the engine at this point, but it should definately be there. I just think a carrier should actually carry its fighters. This would also make sense if you added some kind of high speed drive to the Avalon (slipstream perhaps) so it would be more usefull as a tactical strike unit. As it is poorly shielded and has a limited build number, it shouldnt push too far on balance, but give Admiral Risner a good trick up her sleeve to bring her on par with Mayson. The Avalon is supposed to be the pride and joy of risners fleet. It should have a few cool toys onboard.
I also do not like the idea of fighters that just stay out, like planting a turret. The special energy for weapons idea seems a logical fix to that, if the devs can code them to always return to the ship after depleated. This may also negate the need to have resources at all to launch the fighters, as you would not be able to spam them indefinately. I would say a supply cost at most (the fighters have to be fueled and armed right?) I also think however that the mothership should have an ability to recall all of its fighters. Im not sure how that would be worked into the engine at this point, but it should definately be there. I just think a carrier should actually carry its fighters. This would also make sense if you added some kind of high speed drive to the Avalon (slipstream perhaps) so it would be more usefull as a tactical strike unit. As it is poorly shielded and has a limited build number, it shouldnt push too far on balance, but give Admiral Risner a good trick up her sleeve to bring her on par with Mayson. The Avalon is supposed to be the pride and joy of risners fleet. It should have a few cool toys onboard.
posted on September 16th, 2009, 6:36 am
Every Carrier that launches a Fighter squadron has a cost, in tritanium, dilithium and supplies. I don't remember the dil/trit cost ( 200/50 may be? ), but it costs 15 supplies to launch the fighters. So if you have 4 Carriers, you are spending 60 supplies ( plus dil/trit ) every time you launch fighters. This is for the Dominion B5, I don't remember the costs for the Avalon.
There is also a time limit between fighter waves, like in warp in. You cannot spam fighters happily at your leisure.
But yes, besides that, the carrier works like a fighter factory, with unlimited amounts of fighter launched over time, the more time, the more fighters it has launched (provided you have the resources and you launch a wave as soon as the game lets you).
There is also a time limit between fighter waves, like in warp in. You cannot spam fighters happily at your leisure.
But yes, besides that, the carrier works like a fighter factory, with unlimited amounts of fighter launched over time, the more time, the more fighters it has launched (provided you have the resources and you launch a wave as soon as the game lets you).
posted on September 16th, 2009, 12:25 pm
Tyler wrote:Give the fighters Special energy that doesn't recharge, with the Torps taking a certain amount?
But then special abilities like on the C-11 can give more energy...
posted on September 16th, 2009, 1:29 pm
Which would be like transporting fresh Torps to the ship... hardly something impossible.
posted on September 16th, 2009, 5:33 pm
You can beam them over, right? Why do you have to dock on a station when you only want to recharge your torpedos? Just beam them over. A docking is only needed if you have a damaged ship that must be repaired or if you want to rebuild that unit.
A carrier should be able to build quite a number of blueprints. But it you should have a limited amount of fighters you can hold around your vessel/station. But I think we have now two main pruposes:
a) The carrier
b) the defense station
The carrier can launch and build fighters like we have now and those fighters should fullfill both roles, defending and attack. For the stations there should be a swarm station, a headquarter so to say. This headquarter is like a start and landing bay for fighters and can launch more of them than a single carrier.
The supplement of fighters should be balanced out with supplies if you want to reload them. They do their job and when they are ready, you beam over additional torpedos with the cost of 1 supply. This is much if you think about 30 fighters flying around on your base and after one mission you lost 30 supplies.
The other thing is the point blank defense system against torps. Those fighters have too less room to carry a full fledged energy reactor, so a battery is more a way to think of it. Every shot will consume a certain amount of special energy in order to fullfill to beam weapon purpose and the torpedos are maxed in numbers. You can handle this with a simple cargo queue that got for example 4 shots and after every torpedo shot it will go down in number until zero.
After that happend the fighter starts to fly back into transporter range (should be short) and the relaunches its mission. Around the station the fighter can reload its special weapon energy through induction.
Same goes for the carrier.
Now the only thing that is left is to discuss about the stats of each fighter. I think the stat of a scout should be okay. The beam weapon deals increased damage against ships, but less damage against stations. (This is the purpose)
So...
attack: 7
{beam weapon} + 33% damage against ships / -33% damage against stations / can eleminate torpedos through point blank
{micro-torpedo} like we know from the klingons
defense: 7
The defense is able to withstand beam weapons better because the ship is so small that it can diffract a part of the energy around the ship. {- 25%} Against torpedos, this ship can dodge really good, but the hit of a torpedo will count to 100%.
System: 2
This unit wont do much self repair or shield regeneration. For this it will visit the carrier or the HQ. This ship dont really needs any system value.
Crew: 2 members... but you cant capture it. After the crew is dead, the fighter gets destroyed. Recrew through carrier or HQ.
Speed: Like a scout.
Range: A little more than artillery when it should fly and short on its own weaponrange.
The question is: Should the fighter be able to level up? This seems to be a little bit out of order in my opinion. I think the HQ should level up like the carrier does and all fighter-units nearby may get a bonus through that. Like all stats + 1 or something like that. If you refit your fighters and level your station up to two golden bars, you may have stats like 9/9/4. And thats the top of all wishes I think.
I like the idea :-)
A carrier should be able to build quite a number of blueprints. But it you should have a limited amount of fighters you can hold around your vessel/station. But I think we have now two main pruposes:
a) The carrier
b) the defense station
The carrier can launch and build fighters like we have now and those fighters should fullfill both roles, defending and attack. For the stations there should be a swarm station, a headquarter so to say. This headquarter is like a start and landing bay for fighters and can launch more of them than a single carrier.
The supplement of fighters should be balanced out with supplies if you want to reload them. They do their job and when they are ready, you beam over additional torpedos with the cost of 1 supply. This is much if you think about 30 fighters flying around on your base and after one mission you lost 30 supplies.
The other thing is the point blank defense system against torps. Those fighters have too less room to carry a full fledged energy reactor, so a battery is more a way to think of it. Every shot will consume a certain amount of special energy in order to fullfill to beam weapon purpose and the torpedos are maxed in numbers. You can handle this with a simple cargo queue that got for example 4 shots and after every torpedo shot it will go down in number until zero.
After that happend the fighter starts to fly back into transporter range (should be short) and the relaunches its mission. Around the station the fighter can reload its special weapon energy through induction.
Same goes for the carrier.
Now the only thing that is left is to discuss about the stats of each fighter. I think the stat of a scout should be okay. The beam weapon deals increased damage against ships, but less damage against stations. (This is the purpose)
So...
attack: 7
{beam weapon} + 33% damage against ships / -33% damage against stations / can eleminate torpedos through point blank
{micro-torpedo} like we know from the klingons
defense: 7
The defense is able to withstand beam weapons better because the ship is so small that it can diffract a part of the energy around the ship. {- 25%} Against torpedos, this ship can dodge really good, but the hit of a torpedo will count to 100%.
System: 2
This unit wont do much self repair or shield regeneration. For this it will visit the carrier or the HQ. This ship dont really needs any system value.
Crew: 2 members... but you cant capture it. After the crew is dead, the fighter gets destroyed. Recrew through carrier or HQ.
Speed: Like a scout.
Range: A little more than artillery when it should fly and short on its own weaponrange.
The question is: Should the fighter be able to level up? This seems to be a little bit out of order in my opinion. I think the HQ should level up like the carrier does and all fighter-units nearby may get a bonus through that. Like all stats + 1 or something like that. If you refit your fighters and level your station up to two golden bars, you may have stats like 9/9/4. And thats the top of all wishes I think.
I like the idea :-)
posted on September 17th, 2009, 3:44 am
In the game Armada 1 - (Millium Mod ver1.9) you had the ability to from the starbase launch shuttlecraft . The shuttle craft were controlable as a unit, however the were not much more effective as a scout in stopping an attack . When they were damaged you were able to run them through a staryard for repair. If one was to modify the files for the fighters could you not do the same as the shuttle craft did in that game ? By allowing them to be at a yard R/R' ed.
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