B'rel too weak

[DOCa Cola]

posted on September 12th, 2011, 1:04 pm

Last edited by DOCa Cola on September 13th, 2011, 1:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Briels are arguably the weakest ship in the game and the fact their crew is so low make it even worse yet they are expected to successfully counter dodes?

Maybe we could give them an advatange like a resistance to assimilation passive that gives them like a 70-80% resistance to assimilation because everyone who serves on a briel are super awesome klingons or something who will beat the implants off a borgs face.

They are weak so they take a couple of hits and they can be beamed on and agaisnt assims they become derelect space trash that the borg can then use to raid you while his main ships beat you to death.

Or maybe some sort of combat passive vs borg like the rhiens have, not the same thing but something that can really make the briels usefull.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 1:13 pm

The B'rel already has a passive that does 50% extra damage to the Dode.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 1:15 pm

didnt you make this thread before?

your suggestion has changed, but there's quite a lot of overlap.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 1:23 pm

Have you tried combat supply?

posted on September 12th, 2011, 2:34 pm

didnt you make this thread before?

your suggestion has changed, but there's quite a lot of overlap.

Not really my last topic was a dode counter this is about making the briel stronger.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 2:49 pm

Not really my last topic was a dode counter this is about making the briel stronger.

your first sentence mentions dodes, then the rest only mentions borg, wanting the brel to be better vs borg.

[Tryptic]

posted on September 12th, 2011, 4:25 pm

Last edited by Tryptic on September 12th, 2011, 4:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

What about this:

Rework Weapon fatigue into something like an "Intercept and Destroy" maneuver.  Make the research more expensive, 1.5 to 2 times as much as it costs now.

The defense boost and perhaps the supply cost remain the same, but instead of granting an offensive bonus, it decreases the brel's offense by 2-3 points and doubles its TWA passive vs long range while removing the weakness vs short range.

This way the Brel can serve as an anti-long range counter without becoming the deadly swarmship of the past.  Because really, we don't want Dodes to be fully counterable, we just want full dode/diamond spam without any other ships to be a bad idea.

EDIT: they'd be good against assims too, you can get the upgrade around the time the borg get their second assim so you don't find your brel swarm suddenly outclassed. 

posted on September 12th, 2011, 4:34 pm

Regarding the B'rel:

  While I still agree in principle that the B'rel is really the least flexible and therefore biggest risk in the Klingon basic ship lineup, changing much of how it is now would break it further.


  The B'rel poorly counters nearly all of the things that it is SUPPOSED to counter currently.  Notable exceptions would be Excelsiors, Sang, and a few others, but rarely is the supply and time invested into setting up hangars for B'rel a good investment.  More often than not they end up being a waste. HOWEVER .... the problem exists that massed B'rel can be a frightening steamroller that few people have seen.  Triple-yard B'rel are a major threat against more than you'd think.

 
  My notion of the B'rel has been that they are a lot like the Saber:  they are a major danger when MASSED, but they just don't do enough (or live long enough) in small numbers to have much use.  Exceptions exist, of course, but on an overall comparative with other basic units their use is limited.

[Anonymous]

posted on September 12th, 2011, 4:57 pm

Last edited by Anonymous on September 12th, 2011, 4:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

The B'rel topic has been brought up again and again. I also made a thread about it two patches ago, so I do understand the problems people have with that little ship.
Boggz is correct with the problem, that many long ranged ships counter the B'rel, I think that's the point why Romulans are very tough for Klingons, they don't have proper tools to fight the Rhienn. However, people often underestimate weapon fatigue or are frightened by its supply costs. WF makes the B'rel so much more useful and durable, I'd still appreciate lower supply costs, but it is already very powerful, considering it's also the only really cheap Klingon special weapon. WF is not a no brainer like the phase plates of the Rhienn(activate, cloak and run or even stay in combat as super tank). If you mix the B'rel with KBQ, wf will make the KBQs your tank, if the enemy still fires on your B'rel - well they have +6 defense now .

The weakness of the B'rel mass production is its inflexibility and that the B'rel is easily countered. A mass of sabres can nearly fight everything with some use, B'rels will get shred once some short ranged ships come around(Scubes for example).
There are some situations where the B'rel is useful: in every game as cheap raiding force(maybe not against Borg), against Sangs, Excels, warbirds, combat assims, B8, as decloaker.
You need to be patient and attack last with the B'rels, when the enemy concentrates on them - wf see above.

The B'rel still needs very much micro, too much for a cheap ship like that in my eyes, but it's not the weakest ship in the game.

Edit: you shouldn't build small ships against assim assims, no matter shich race you play. I think the Klingons on the whole have too small crew levels, but not the B'rel.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 5:14 pm

about dode counters, they are already easy to counter if you happen to be federation. just make a couple monsoons then the dodes auto target the monsoons and not your warpins, then the dodes do no damage and can only disable monsoon sensors (not sure if that's intended, it cant disable any other system).

about brels, perhaps making its special be more useful, but cost more. so that its not terribly effective in bunches cos it will drain your money.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 5:42 pm

your first sentence mentions dodes, then the rest only mentions borg, wanting the brel to be better vs borg.

Yeah to make the briel stronger vs borg...how are you not getting this?

posted on September 12th, 2011, 5:52 pm

Yeah to make the briel stronger vs borg...how are you not getting this?

that's pretty much what your last thread was about too, brel sucks vs dodes, brel sucks vs borg.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 6:04 pm

Perhaps the B'rel should launch canisters with mp3 of klingon opera towards the dode.

Klingon opera drives anyone but klingons insane.

posted on September 12th, 2011, 6:31 pm

Perhaps the B'rel should launch canisters with mp3 of klingon opera towards the dode.

Klingon opera drives anyone but klingons insane.

LOL

posted on September 12th, 2011, 9:49 pm

Giving the b'rel a plus 10 speed boost woulden't make it stronger, but at least it would be able to raid and escape better.