The Empire's choice?

posted on October 16th, 2008, 12:14 pm

ST-v-SW.Net :: The Star Trek vs. Star Wars Tech Assessment Index

Read this site. Trek Vs Wars is one-sided, but not in the way everyone thinks.

[Smoerebroed]

posted on October 16th, 2008, 1:14 pm

Last edited by Smoerebroed on October 16th, 2008, 4:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I love it how the internet is able to ruin sarcasm

posted on October 17th, 2008, 1:45 am

Oh garsh, Emperor Palpatine is here himself 

posted on October 17th, 2008, 2:17 am

for all those who voted Romulan or Dominion, know that the Empire was purely anti-alien.
Palpatine was to aliens what the KKK is to blacks.

case closed.

posted on October 17th, 2008, 4:28 am

Yup, another reason I voted Terran.

[Casper]

posted on October 17th, 2008, 1:17 pm

Last edited by Casper on October 17th, 2008, 10:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

dido (for those of you not familiar with this slang spelling it means Ditto, I’ve been hassled for that in another forum)

posted on December 7th, 2008, 1:23 am

Unfortunately Palpatine's ... xenophobia... was not always so discrete. Thrawn after all was allowed to serve, and he was part alien. He also used alien forces and tech, although rather limitedly. Not quite a perfect xenophobic monolith though.

posted on March 26th, 2009, 4:23 am

noone..........its the empire they would simply crush everyone.

[Anonymous]

posted on March 26th, 2009, 4:26 pm

Last edited by Anonymous on March 26th, 2009, 4:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

not necessarily. Palpatine is always prudent before aggressive. He would most certainly want to establish an alliance to initially understand this galaxy in order to establish a proper plan of attack. Then once all is in place he would execute his plans. typically by the very nature of his plans and movements he would undermine the aide that is allied wth him so as to eventually subjugate them as well.

In fact IMO the feds would best suit this. they are eager to share information with potential allies who are interested in learning and sharing their information of their galaxy. the feds are human dominated, where aliens are secondary in most starfleet operations. their allies are aggressive klingons who are eager for war and attack and on many an instance are the antithesis of fed values.

Romulans are the only remaining enemies in the alpha quadrant. Creating a base in the galaxy first, then creating a rift and then exploiting it si something that Palpy is most familiar with - particularly since his plans are not executed in quick succession like the founders, which would point to the source. Instead his draw on for years in slow attrition, keeping the attention away from him and making it look like the natural course of events.

posted on March 26th, 2009, 4:45 pm

his plans are not executed in quick succession like the founders, which would point to the source. Instead his draw on for years in slow attrition, keeping the attention away from him and making it look like the natural course of events.

You know that it is the Dominion method you just described, right?

[Anonymous]

posted on March 26th, 2009, 5:29 pm

Last edited by Anonymous on March 26th, 2009, 6:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

You know that it is the Dominion method you just described, right?

all imperialists have similar strategies. however, in DS9 the founders tried to engineer acts overtly, overusing their shapeshifitng abilities which ultimately resulted in their exposure.

Palpatine was more subtle. He preferred to use existing strife and disagreements to his advantage before involving himself directly at the very end.
the dominion were premature in many respects compared to Palpatine.

1. the bashir incident.
2. the martok incident
3. the Ds9 cardassian incident.
4. the main mistake of being aggressive with the feds from the start. If u noticed palpatine, he didnt attack the jedis from the start. instead he approached the jedi as their ally and trusted friend - the grandfatherly senator from naboo who became chancellor out of pure sympathy for his planet's situation.

In fact if the Dominion were to follow Palpatine's style, the dynamics would change a bit. Palpatine would be aware that the key to the alpha quadrant from a dominion perspective is the wormhole. also, palpatine would be motivated by conquest, not keeping the feds out of the gamma quadrant.

They would therefore, present themselves as fed allies after having studied fed behaviour. In "the search" they even saw that the feds would never accept dominion control - and if u notice the Dominion were always forceful in trying to push their demands onto the feds.
If they were to be as Palpatine, they would ally themselves with the feds and allow limited fed research and civilian colonies into their space- easy targets that would be destroyed once war were to being.
Section 31 would not go for the founder virus either given that they only went after the founders due to their hostilities towards the feds. colonists in the gamma quadrant would certainly be looked upon as spies and monitored closely.. in typical founder impersonator style. section 31 infiltration at that level would be easily exploited with misinformation. section 31 or any fed intelligence outfit would not pass up such easy access to the gamma quadrant and would present an interesting game of chess.

In the like vein they would request that the feds allowed them into fed space and establish minor outposts for vorta and jem'hadar research and information exchange. In dominion style those would be small scale cloning facilities to merely replace any scientists or researchers who would die on this long term mission - dominion tradition which is benign enough for the feds to respect..

Ships would be minimal initially restricted to basic traffic as the 2 sides start to adjust to knowing each other.
In the gamma quadrant, the fed would be monitored and kept away from military installations. no access to dominion military installations.
In this time the founder martok impersonator would allege that the dominion has infiltrated the detapa council and is trying to undermine the klingon empire. The feds would not believe such a claim as they are allied with the dominion. the detapa council itself it not infiltrated so there is no corroboration of dominion wrong doing.
The dominion would attempt to offer concessions to maquis rebels in order to achieve a cessation of hostilities between them and the cardassians, and make overtures of direct contact with the new detapa council offering to resolve the cardassian-fed disputes and resolve fed-cardy hostilities.
The klingons would see this as more attempts to isolate them by the dominion and given the already pre-existing desire to go to war (which was used by gowron in series), the martok impersonator would push the KLlings to attack cardassia. The feds of course would refuse to interfere, as would the dominion at the outset once more vindicating their neutrality.
klingon aggression would continue as in the main series with the displacement of the detapa council.
the khitomer accords would be dissolved.
At this point the dominion are openly approached (rather are present in front of the unloaded detapa council on DS9) and hear calls for assistance. Initially maintaining neutrality, they will eventually cede to Dukat's personal demands.
as dominion fleets now flow into the alpha quadrant, the feds will voice concerns, but will not openly interfere or block the wormhole as (if this were typical palpatine style) the dominion would be acting only in the interest of the greater peace and have already demonstrated a commitment to such by their previous actions. they establish massive ship building facilities in cardassian space and dig in as they beat back the klings.
gowron will never head to DS9 to ever reinstate the khitomer accords as they view the feds as enemies who are standing by dishonorably as the dominion beats them back.
the dominion after beating back the Klings they will propose restrictions on the klingons that they know the klingons will never meet - a disarmament of all klingon production facilities along a certain distance from the klingon-cardassian border as well as reparations for actions that hve caused damages and loss of cardassian lives - another just demand by human standards of equity.. An offer of peace that would go to their advantage either way.
The martok impersonator refuses as a great dishonor, and himself commands a breach of interim ceasefire - selling it as the perfect moment to trike when the enemy is sleeping - the dominion will of course present a convenient target to allow him to sell this excuse, but will be waiting in ambush.
the war resumed by the klingons themselves, the feds will have no choice but to remain neutral. Klings will be pushed to the brink and will either capitulate and sign to terms that are now even more damaging or will ahve to accept completely eing overrun by the dominion.
Romulans will certainly be uneasy by all this and will be watching with great attention, but will not move either way. they can't - if they choose to ally with teh klingons they are still outnumbered as in typical romulan fashion they will first watch and evaluate, reaching a decision to help the klings in self-interest only on seeing how far the conflict is going. at that stage, the klings are alrady on the backfoot and without fed assistance they will not stand a chance. also, the dominion in this instance will hve full access to teh wormhole fleets as teh feds will not impede a war of defense, while bolstering their forces from facilities built in cardassian space and fed space (not so much in fed space, but more as a sign to the klings that the feds have betrayed their trust, while low in number enough to keep the feds from raising any concerns of "waging war from our space" - maybe a few symbolic k-white facilities etc near the cardassian border)


Once the klings are beaten down, the dominion can focus on the feds. and with only feds and romulans to contend with - since the major bulk of the cardassian fleet was already punished b4 dominion entry into the war, the Dominion would run through the alpha quadrant.

This is of course my superficial take, which Ive just thrown together, and may certainly have loopholes. But the point is to elucidate how Palpatine's approach differs from the Dominion approach, although in overview they both rely on subterfuge and "divide and conquer" policies.