Neelix?

[Tyler]

posted on February 24th, 2011, 3:59 pm

Last edited by Tyler on February 24th, 2011, 4:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Just wondering what people here thought of the bar rodent Neelix? Not Voyager, the stereotypical Ent first officer or the supervillainess Captain; just Neelix.

Just curious because I've been searching 'Neelix hate' and seen conflicting views; some who see him as a well-written and 3-Dimentional character, and some who see him as a... well, shithead.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 4:28 pm

I don't see why everyone hates him. I think he's a perfectly fine character. I think some people try to view him as just another of the "typical" Star Trek aliens, when he's not. By typical I mean the sort that we see in TNG and DS9; the kind that are from stable, space faring planets, which have contact with the outside universe. Neelix isn't that, he's quite the opposite, a loner type who has no real home, little contact with others of his species, just a little junker space ship and his trade business. He has that hard life sort of perspective that the Federation crew lack because they have lived in the Federation. Even the Maquis members had it pretty easy. In some ways he's like characters commonly found in Star Wars. And yes, he's not a fighter, he'd sooner run and hide, and there's nothing wrong with that; in fact it's the more natural response. Despite that he's a very sociable sort and Voyager needed someone like that who could provide a distraction to the fact that they were stranded half a galaxy away.

So, I think Neelix really gets the short end of the stick and gets criticized for being a little atypical. He's not human, and that's the point; he has a different perspective and different culture and he brings that to Voyager. In fact Voyager probably would have had it a lot rougher without him.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 4:37 pm

That's what he was meant to be, a lot of the 'issues' tend to come from opinions that the writers appeared to forget that after the first few episodes.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 4:42 pm

I never really like him the only funny moment i saw with him wasnt even him it was when Q addressed him as you there bar rodent get me a drink. That was pretty funny.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 5:09 pm

If you watch SFDebris' reviews, you really get all of Neelix' problems pointed out. The most noticable one has to be how he claims to be a survival expert, and then repeatedly gets people almost killed when they listen to his advice on such things.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 5:12 pm

That's what he was meant to be, a lot of the 'issues' tend to come from opinions that the writers appeared to forget that after the first few episodes.

Well that may be (honestly I don't really remember, it's been a long time since I've seen any Voyager), but I think it's also true of Neelix that he can adapt well, blend into the predominant culture quickly, because he's spent so much time going from place to place.

If you watch SFDebris' reviews, you really get all of Neelix' problems pointed out. The most noticable one has to be how he claims to be a survival expert, and then repeatedly gets people almost killed when they listen to his advice on such things.

Well, his claim to be a "survival expert" is not necessarily wrong; he's certainly survived quite a bit. But most of the time, what he did just happened to work. Essentially he's just very lucky.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 5:18 pm

I think he is a survival expert, just not in the way he thinks he is; he convinced Janeway he was worth keeping around, now he lives on a powerful ship where he's relativly safe from all his enemies.

Sucking up those more powerful is a great way to survive, if you can keep it up.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 5:18 pm

i voted him as great character, i mean if people are still talking about him a decade after the show ended he had to have done something right. who talks about chakotay as anything more than a plank of wood with a giant tattoo painted on it? admiral ross was acted better.

dont get me wrong, neelix makes me cringe because he is annoying and has many negative qualities that remind me of myself. but he does have 3 full dimensions, something u dont see often in voyager (unless you count the stupid holodeck eps with chaotica and random numbers of dimensions )

he did actually develop as a character. he started off really obnoxious, doing everything for himself and being a super arsehole. each season he got better as a person. by the end he was still extremely annoying, but at least he wasnt an arsehole anymore, he was a good guy, being valiant and stuff.

He actually had backstory that was consistent, and his acting matched his character development. he also provided comic relief as the funny foreigner alien.

compare him with sheriff commander woody, who only had backstory when they wanted to point out how they had a new ethnicity on the show, see native americans can go in space too also they randomly added backstory to him in bottle episodes. like 1 ep he loves being a pacifist, then later he wants to punch the daylights of everything in a boxing ring, then later he wants to study ancient cultures, i mean come on, they kept giving him new interests without considering previous characterisations of him.

the archaeology thing could have went well with being a pacifist if they had kept it consistent and done it over multiple eps, maybe had him argue with janeway over blowing stuff up in an ep.

picard had that already though, and that was done properly, you went into picards mansion quarters and you saw old stuff.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 5:45 pm

Yeah, I think Neelix really does grow up. He starts as the sort who will run to power and hide behind it, but in the end he is willing to leave what is probably the only home he's had in a long time to stay with his own people.

I'm not sure how Chakotay counts as a pacifist. He was a Maquis cell leader after all. But he does strike me as the sort who will try to avoid fighting if it's at all possible. And I don't really think Chakotay's as discontinuous as he might seem.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 5:51 pm

I'm not sure how Chakotay counts as a pacifist. He was a Maquis cell leader after all. But he does strike me as the sort who will try to avoid fighting if it's at all possible. And I don't really think Chakotay's as discontinuous as he might seem.

thats the thing, his backstory doesnt match up. he leads a terrorist cell yet in some eps they protray him as a pacifist who doesnt wanna hurt a fly. what doesnt help is that they rarely expanded on him as a character.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 5:56 pm

It's possible to be a pacifist and be a terrorist at the same time, some don't like violence but are willing to resort to it if they really need to. They didn't quite get the right balance, though, and made him too much of a pacifist.

He got a new 'hobby' every episode he was allowed to be a character, instead of a part of the scenery.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 6:09 pm

Apparently the guys who play Neelix and Odo from DS9 are really good friends. I heard a pretty funny interview with both of them on a podcast once

posted on February 24th, 2011, 6:22 pm

It's possible to be a pacifist and be a terrorist at the same time, some don't like violence but are willing to resort to it if they really need to. They didn't quite get the right balance, though, and made him too much of a pacifist.

He got a new 'hobby' every episode he was allowed to be a character, instead of a part of the scenery.

Exactly. No matter how much of a pacifist you claim to be, there will always be something out there large enough to piss you off to the point that you feel violence is the only option.

As for the hobby issue, some people just like doing a wide variety of things. can anyone honestly say that they've never wanted to try all kinds of things, even if only once. Besides, they're stuck on a starship a lifetime away from home. It's gonna get pretty damn boring if you don't try new things.

posted on February 24th, 2011, 6:26 pm

the only once argument doesnt hold, as they characterise chakotay as always doing these things. its not he plays boxing once and didnt like it, its his favourite thing, then we never hear about it again. same with archaeology. these things were supposed to be things he has done all his life.

posted on February 25th, 2011, 12:44 pm

It's true Chakotay was pretty much ruined by the writers he never got any sort of continuity.

However Neelix was a great character, He developed properly over the 7 seasons almost as much as the Doctor.

Voyager was another good idea poorly implemented show, Shame too as if it was written well and less about phasers and more about morality and not Janeway doing whatever the hell she wants it would have worked.

Don't get me wrong I love the big two part battle stories like Year of Hell and Scorpion but you can't help but feel it just became every week there was some battle for no reason.