Iconians for the next release.

posted on March 15th, 2009, 10:52 pm

Well as we learned in a TNG episode most humanoid races actually evolved out of "seeds" an ancient race droped in the oceans of many, many planets.

The Iconians, however, are much to old. Yes, they are humanoid, but are not as close to us humans as for example the Romulans or the Klingons. And they have quite a different view of space and time in general. Well, and they are a bit arrogant one could say, refering to us "new" species as children!

posted on March 15th, 2009, 11:18 pm

The Iconians are too old? ...but when there civilization was destroyed they were only 200,000 years old... whereas the "Ancient Humanoids" were 4.5 billion years old... are you suggesting that the Iconians have a different heritage perhaps? 

posted on March 15th, 2009, 11:44 pm

0o awesome

my pov: i think iconians should have really strong and powerful ships but slow and susceptible to range attacks so they must rely on support ships and special effects..  though I imagin u guys have something else completely different in mind. Im looking foward.  Any teasers coming ?

<3

posted on March 16th, 2009, 12:11 am

Who knows?  The Iconians could be a survivor offshoot of the Preservers who did the seeding in the first place.  And if the book Vendetta is taken as FO canon, this would give the Iconians one hell of a grudge against the Borg, and a determination not to repeat the mistakes of their ancestors.

[Anonymous]

posted on March 16th, 2009, 12:41 am

Last edited by Anonymous on March 16th, 2009, 12:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

They can bear all the grudges they want.   Grudges - a sign of chaotic imperfection.. a race that still flaunts its imperfections even after eons of existence is in no position to speak of another's mistakes.

None can compare to the perfection and order of the collective.

Resistance is and always has been.. futile.

posted on March 16th, 2009, 12:53 am

Many fictional 'higher beings' are as bad as the normal races. Ain't hypocrites great?

[Anonymous]

posted on March 16th, 2009, 2:54 pm

Last edited by Anonymous on March 16th, 2009, 3:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Many fictional 'higher beings' are as bad as the normal races. Ain't hypocrites great?

Kinda. depends on how you define "higher". Most of the races in ST aren't actually higher. They are merely super endowed but cannot be conceptualized as "higher" since the ones doing the script writing are limited organics that are themselves mired in the basest of qualities. Hence they cannot visualize what a higher being is supposed to be.
Same problem with Stargate and its spin offs.

So to compensate the writers necessarily have to include 'higher' with base traits. Pure fiction and hence it becomes difficult to judge one way or the other.

posted on March 16th, 2009, 4:11 pm

they should be telepaths that would give them a unique set of specials

posted on March 16th, 2009, 6:05 pm

By 'higher', I meant 'more evolved'. Like the Q.

posted on March 16th, 2009, 8:55 pm

Meh. More evolved doesn't exist. 

[Anonymous]

posted on March 16th, 2009, 9:35 pm

Last edited by Anonymous on March 16th, 2009, 9:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

By 'higher', I meant 'more evolved'. Like the Q.

to be more evolved does not entail power or intellect. Those are artificial markers that are endemic to what we are taught from childhood.
Intellect and power are tools to survive. Just as arms and legs. each person has the tools that go towards his existence and the maintenance thereof - some have it easy some don't.

But what makes a being "higher"? Intellect, a good body, a handsome face? Or the ability to realize and master his base traits - the traits of the animal in him?

Intellect, strength are tools. a means to an end. The end being victory of the being over his animal self as proof of his evolution.

Q fails in that miserably. He has no mastery over himself, nor do the borg or any of the other higher races of STU.
most are portrayed as spoiled children. This may be due to Roddenberry's own opinions on things, but does not reflect what a higher being would ever achieve on his path of ascension.

From our species what we do see is that raw intellect w/o introspection and basic mastery over greed, lust, hate, anger will lead that intellect to be applied as nothing more than a tool to spin facts and arguments towards unrealistic polemics that ultimately lead to the assuagement of more animal desires and urges that finally lead to retarding catastrophes instead of progressive development.

example - sub-prime was a direct outcome of unabridled greed. the intellect was used to draft a scheme that was so lucrative, yet resulted in an even greater catastrophe that screwed everyone.
the Iraq war and the polemics around it.
The Israeli-Palestinian conflict.
Vietnam
Korea
WW 1
WW 2
Colonialism
Racism
Slavery
Neo-imperialism
and the list goes on and on.

In fact what we see is nothing more than a regurgitation of the same quagmires and basic human problems that we have been seeing for the past 2500 years - in spite of higher education, more technical advancement and the rest.

Would the Q ever evolve in a vacuum w/o similar central humanoid questions? How could they have reached where they were and still retain traits which would hinder them from extricating themselves from similar quagmires and tragedies?

Goes to show how central the improvement of the self is to the evolution of the species and not just material or genetic improvements such as intellect, physical strength, new technology  etc.

Which is why one can say that in the STU - more evolved is a concept that has not been addressed by the creators of the show and hence does not exist