Starfleet Command idea
Post ideas and suggestions on new features or improvements here.
posted on June 30th, 2011, 10:29 pm
OK so there are many folks out there that feel the feds are still OP, better balanced but still able to fedroll with warp in. Anyways my brain often works overtime trying to come up with newer ideas and sometimes repeated ones since Im to lazy to go sifting through the millions of threads around here.... Any ways on to my idea
I dont know if this mechanic is allowed in the engine yet but I was thinking the Starfleet command building should have a resource upkeep. Over so many seconds the building should consume a small amount of Dilithium and Tritanium as well as supply. It is after all a "command center" of a sort for your sector, not just a subspace relay and its within reason to assume that given its Command authority it would need resources for operational "technobabble".
Now some might say its unbalancing if for instance youve reached a cap for your warp in and your now paying for a building that is no longer in use. For that I was thinking a replace weapon would be cool, basically it powers down the station leaving you with just that a "station" that no longer consumes resource and cant warp in ships, after a cool down, you can toggle back to a powered up version with all the resource usage and ability to call for warp in - heres the kicker though. After toggling from off to on, the energy must fully recharge before you can call in a warp in.
OK thoughts welcome fire away!
I dont know if this mechanic is allowed in the engine yet but I was thinking the Starfleet command building should have a resource upkeep. Over so many seconds the building should consume a small amount of Dilithium and Tritanium as well as supply. It is after all a "command center" of a sort for your sector, not just a subspace relay and its within reason to assume that given its Command authority it would need resources for operational "technobabble".
Now some might say its unbalancing if for instance youve reached a cap for your warp in and your now paying for a building that is no longer in use. For that I was thinking a replace weapon would be cool, basically it powers down the station leaving you with just that a "station" that no longer consumes resource and cant warp in ships, after a cool down, you can toggle back to a powered up version with all the resource usage and ability to call for warp in - heres the kicker though. After toggling from off to on, the energy must fully recharge before you can call in a warp in.
OK thoughts welcome fire away!
posted on June 30th, 2011, 10:33 pm
I dunno. I feel like the last patch was a bit of a nerf patch (ambassador speed, B5 cost, warbird cost, vorcha firing arc...) and now the devs are looking to add instead. I think instead of putting even MORE restrictions on warpin, the plan is to increase the options of the other races a bit so they can deal with feds more creatively.
posted on July 3rd, 2011, 11:06 pm
The best current option to fix star fleet command is either drop number of ships to 2 per warp in or more ships on the weaker 2 slots of warpins. Adding a resource upkeep cost would actually add an outsize reason to use it even heavier.
posted on July 4th, 2011, 4:06 pm
My first suggestion is to get 1 Warpin at the first time, 2 warpins the second and 3 beyond the second.
That way early game is not that bad for other factions.
Second suggestion is to make the monsoon a medium range ship so it can be countered easier...that way the killer combo Monsoon/Intrepid/Warpins is less effective.
That way early game is not that bad for other factions.
Second suggestion is to make the monsoon a medium range ship so it can be countered easier...that way the killer combo Monsoon/Intrepid/Warpins is less effective.
posted on July 4th, 2011, 5:23 pm
monsoon medium ranged? 
A Fed ship with decent damage output that always hits should get an increase in range making the Feds stronger against all small ships? No thanks. Think about it that way: with one anti short range counter you get Monsoons AND Intrepids - the whole usual early Fed fleet.
Concerning topic I hope Tryptic is right
. But I also think warp in still needs some tweaking. It's simply too easy and every race is fighting against the clock when facing Feds, whereas they are fighting against ressource production when facing all the other races.
A Fed ship with decent damage output that always hits should get an increase in range making the Feds stronger against all small ships? No thanks. Think about it that way: with one anti short range counter you get Monsoons AND Intrepids - the whole usual early Fed fleet.Concerning topic I hope Tryptic is right
. But I also think warp in still needs some tweaking. It's simply too easy and every race is fighting against the clock when facing Feds, whereas they are fighting against ressource production when facing all the other races.posted on July 4th, 2011, 5:54 pm
I think warpins are almost perfect, but here are some ideas for finishing off their balance:
-Lower the Centaur's offense by a few points and add its chance to both sides.
AND/OR
-Add the New Orleans as a third "weak" warpin, as was suggested on Tunngle last night
-Lower the ROF of the Excelsior's bonus torpedo from 1 second to 2 seconds. This won't change damage at all, but it will make it less of a burst.
-Increase the Teutoburg's offense. Ironically, when it isn't bugging out the Teutoburg takes a very long time to bring down turrets. Since you are getting it in place of 4 smaller ships, I think it's okay to give it a few more points of offense
-Increase the Descent's offense by a lot (35->45, maybe?) and decrease its defense to 70 or less. Increase shield reset range to medium (yes, medium. Dogfight is impossible to use) and make it so using shield reset reduces the Descent's speed from 90->70 and its shield/armor repair rate to zero for about 10 seconds.
If I understand correctly, ships repairing at a yard get a large bonus to their repair rate, so having a rate of 0 would mean it doesn't repair until the effect ends? My thinking is that if the Descent can ACTUALLY be destroyed, it's okay to buff it up to make an awesome flagship. Also, while it's Starfleet style to have massive defense at the expense of offense, the current numbers make it very hard to rank-up a Descent which is kind of the point of having one.
comments, ideas?
-Lower the Centaur's offense by a few points and add its chance to both sides.
AND/OR
-Add the New Orleans as a third "weak" warpin, as was suggested on Tunngle last night
-Lower the ROF of the Excelsior's bonus torpedo from 1 second to 2 seconds. This won't change damage at all, but it will make it less of a burst.
-Increase the Teutoburg's offense. Ironically, when it isn't bugging out the Teutoburg takes a very long time to bring down turrets. Since you are getting it in place of 4 smaller ships, I think it's okay to give it a few more points of offense
-Increase the Descent's offense by a lot (35->45, maybe?) and decrease its defense to 70 or less. Increase shield reset range to medium (yes, medium. Dogfight is impossible to use) and make it so using shield reset reduces the Descent's speed from 90->70 and its shield/armor repair rate to zero for about 10 seconds.
If I understand correctly, ships repairing at a yard get a large bonus to their repair rate, so having a rate of 0 would mean it doesn't repair until the effect ends? My thinking is that if the Descent can ACTUALLY be destroyed, it's okay to buff it up to make an awesome flagship. Also, while it's Starfleet style to have massive defense at the expense of offense, the current numbers make it very hard to rank-up a Descent which is kind of the point of having one.
comments, ideas?
posted on July 4th, 2011, 5:56 pm
Last edited by Anonymous on July 4th, 2011, 6:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
anti short range counters dont always work well against feds, at least not as good as you would hope, guess thats the price you pay for countering two ships at once.
dom: they do intreps, you field bombers, they field mons, which dodge 40% and take 50% less, and get auto targeted. you have to switch between protos to counter, they just move between intreps and mons with ease. so you have no true counter to chassis 1 spam, you need a mixed fleet to remain competitive.
klink: charghs are avatar specific, but actually dont do too bad. they will get outnumbered so will need some field yard support. they dont excel against either mon or intrep, as intrep takes 30% less and dodges 20% from chargh and mon dodges 40%, chargh does 50% extra to each, so its not a real counter, just something that does good damage, but will probably need to be part of a mixed fleet.
vorchas are good too, but do less damage to intreps. in this case they get warpins or e2, which actually requires them to spend money to adapt. at least you can switch to sangs to deal with warpins/e2, but then you lose the tanking power of the vorchas, as they no longer get auto targeted. basically both you and the fed can switch around to counter the other, so again mixed fleets are the order of the day.
feds: mix some canavs in with your own chassis 1 ships, tends to do ok. but then again you have the exact same chassis 1 ships as they do.
roms: phase plates rhienns are quite useful for tanking, but dont cut the mustard damage wise against mons, so you must mix rhienns in with a mixed fleet. i would like to hear opinions on genspecs, i just think they are a little late in the tech tree to work against chassis 1 spam, you would be outnumbered and bumrushed. and intreps negate their passive a little bit. one of the best counters you will get to chassis 1 spam.
borg: dont have anti short range passive. as usual if u counter intreps (with dodes) then they get mons to auto target tank. this is even worse for borg as they build very few ships, and once they spend large sums/cc on a chassis, they cant go back or change counters. this hurts the borg in general, but even more vs chassis 1 spam as they can switch between mon and intrep with no effort. i nearly slapped myself when i clicked dode instead of scube once against s2 spam.
sum up: theres no real point getting counters to particular chassis 1 ships, as they can just switch between the two chassis 1 ships so easily. and chassis 1 ships remain effective long enough to end the game (especially when combined with warpins/e2)
EDIT:
@nerfing the centaur: i love that idea, i would happily accept more centaurs if they were slightly weaker than e1s (id personally love them to be weaker than chassis 1 ships). i love the centaur, but right now its an awesome warpin to get.
@new orleans as a weak warpin: i think i mentioned this a day or two ago, i like this idea. feds need more warpins that arent awesome. the galaxy/ambas/torp neb/rhode island set themselves up in the show as being hugely powerful. and hence have to be rarer to preserve balance. it would be nice to have ships added which are weak, and give the weak warpins variety. new orleans/steamy/cheyenne come to mind. they could always add the sabre to the warpin, i mean we saw them die by the truckload in FC, some of them might respond to distress calls.
@slow the e1 torp spam down: i like this too. for the weakest warpin with a vulnerable passive it still is awesome at the start of battle as it puts out some serious dps. makes borgies wet themselves.
@making the teuto stronger: i think it wouldnt hurt, most times 4 normal warpins will smack a turret down faster than a teuto. the only thing a teuto is good for is in those rare cases when someone uber turtles and you have loads of time to whittle their turrets away. gotta be careful not to make it too strong, especially as you can choose when you want one.
@descent idea: too much offence will make it a bit strong early on. right now it struggles to get kills on early game ships, which i think is necessary. and i definitely dont want it to get medium range shield reset. that would make its special too awesome. right now it can give itself a second life, and any ships that happen to be nearby. so with effort and micro you can give 2 or 3 ships second lives.
dom: they do intreps, you field bombers, they field mons, which dodge 40% and take 50% less, and get auto targeted. you have to switch between protos to counter, they just move between intreps and mons with ease. so you have no true counter to chassis 1 spam, you need a mixed fleet to remain competitive.
klink: charghs are avatar specific, but actually dont do too bad. they will get outnumbered so will need some field yard support. they dont excel against either mon or intrep, as intrep takes 30% less and dodges 20% from chargh and mon dodges 40%, chargh does 50% extra to each, so its not a real counter, just something that does good damage, but will probably need to be part of a mixed fleet.
vorchas are good too, but do less damage to intreps. in this case they get warpins or e2, which actually requires them to spend money to adapt. at least you can switch to sangs to deal with warpins/e2, but then you lose the tanking power of the vorchas, as they no longer get auto targeted. basically both you and the fed can switch around to counter the other, so again mixed fleets are the order of the day.
feds: mix some canavs in with your own chassis 1 ships, tends to do ok. but then again you have the exact same chassis 1 ships as they do.
roms: phase plates rhienns are quite useful for tanking, but dont cut the mustard damage wise against mons, so you must mix rhienns in with a mixed fleet. i would like to hear opinions on genspecs, i just think they are a little late in the tech tree to work against chassis 1 spam, you would be outnumbered and bumrushed. and intreps negate their passive a little bit. one of the best counters you will get to chassis 1 spam.
borg: dont have anti short range passive. as usual if u counter intreps (with dodes) then they get mons to auto target tank. this is even worse for borg as they build very few ships, and once they spend large sums/cc on a chassis, they cant go back or change counters. this hurts the borg in general, but even more vs chassis 1 spam as they can switch between mon and intrep with no effort. i nearly slapped myself when i clicked dode instead of scube once against s2 spam.
sum up: theres no real point getting counters to particular chassis 1 ships, as they can just switch between the two chassis 1 ships so easily. and chassis 1 ships remain effective long enough to end the game (especially when combined with warpins/e2)
EDIT:
@nerfing the centaur: i love that idea, i would happily accept more centaurs if they were slightly weaker than e1s (id personally love them to be weaker than chassis 1 ships). i love the centaur, but right now its an awesome warpin to get.
@new orleans as a weak warpin: i think i mentioned this a day or two ago, i like this idea. feds need more warpins that arent awesome. the galaxy/ambas/torp neb/rhode island set themselves up in the show as being hugely powerful. and hence have to be rarer to preserve balance. it would be nice to have ships added which are weak, and give the weak warpins variety. new orleans/steamy/cheyenne come to mind. they could always add the sabre to the warpin, i mean we saw them die by the truckload in FC, some of them might respond to distress calls.
@slow the e1 torp spam down: i like this too. for the weakest warpin with a vulnerable passive it still is awesome at the start of battle as it puts out some serious dps. makes borgies wet themselves.
@making the teuto stronger: i think it wouldnt hurt, most times 4 normal warpins will smack a turret down faster than a teuto. the only thing a teuto is good for is in those rare cases when someone uber turtles and you have loads of time to whittle their turrets away. gotta be careful not to make it too strong, especially as you can choose when you want one.
@descent idea: too much offence will make it a bit strong early on. right now it struggles to get kills on early game ships, which i think is necessary. and i definitely dont want it to get medium range shield reset. that would make its special too awesome. right now it can give itself a second life, and any ships that happen to be nearby. so with effort and micro you can give 2 or 3 ships second lives.
posted on July 4th, 2011, 6:03 pm
Tryptic wrote:-Increase the Descent's offense by a lot (35->45, maybe?) and decrease its defense to 70 or less. Increase shield reset range to medium (yes, medium. Dogfight is impossible to use) and make it so using shield reset reduces the Descent's speed from 90->70
Not entirely sure about this. The massive defense works for the role as a defensive battleship, but making the offensive value higher than battleship average doesn't. I like the Shield reset changes, though.
Tryptic wrote:-Increase the Teutoburg's offense. Ironically, when it isn't bugging out the Teutoburg takes a very long time to bring down turrets. Since you are getting it in place of 4 smaller ships, I think it's okay to give it a few more points of offense
I agree. The offense is oddly poor for a torp spammer, it's almost useless when the specials run out.
posted on July 4th, 2011, 6:06 pm
But Borg can take over enemy ships through boarding special, which is very useful against ships with small crew number. Let all your scubes do that against an intrepid or so and you get it, while the feds lost it.
I think, that if the borg would play that feature out, they can overrun the feds with masses of scubes. Also the feds do much of their damage via torps and scubes will evade them good, while you can counter their passives. I think the borg dont do bad against feds with a lot of scubes. But it is hard to build larger chassis after an scube-spam, that you must do more or less when facing the feds, so you dont have a real damage dealer. Assim is the most crucial counter against feds and you must do it good. Same goes against klingons.
I think, that if the borg would play that feature out, they can overrun the feds with masses of scubes. Also the feds do much of their damage via torps and scubes will evade them good, while you can counter their passives. I think the borg dont do bad against feds with a lot of scubes. But it is hard to build larger chassis after an scube-spam, that you must do more or less when facing the feds, so you dont have a real damage dealer. Assim is the most crucial counter against feds and you must do it good. Same goes against klingons.
posted on July 4th, 2011, 7:00 pm
The battles Myles is talking about occur too early in the game to get a transmission matrix up. At that point all your resources are going into ships so you don't fall behind in the numbers.
posted on July 4th, 2011, 9:25 pm
scubes dont dodge torps well unfortunately. even the scout cube is medium sized. it dodges like a vorcha, not very well, only 20% miss rate.
the probe is small, and dodges 40%, but is not quick enough to live past the early game, your probes will dodge 40% but they still arent cheap enough to be acceptable losses imo.
and yes im talking before transmission. and before spheres.
the probe is small, and dodges 40%, but is not quick enough to live past the early game, your probes will dodge 40% but they still arent cheap enough to be acceptable losses imo.
and yes im talking before transmission. and before spheres.
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