Some Ideas about starting in neutral and building up to war
posted on November 15th, 2008, 3:36 am
Last edited by Anonymous on November 18th, 2008, 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Someone in the Beta testing Forum mentioned how Armand 1 started in neutral and it got me to think about way to expand this in post 3.0 Fleet Ops Version and I wanted to start a thread here for all to share... Here are my thoughts about it and to expand on the idea and make GREEN-YELLOW-RED Alert Status really make or break the game, adding to the depth, suspense, buildup to war and realism of it all....
For starters, with the ARMADA 1 idea of starting all players neutral and even starting at green alert across the boards. Then only going to war by choice via Trade Menu Options or by Alert Status and, therefore, attack actions of your ships, you could really make a lot of outcome changes, and AI choices per game for very different outcomes. Maybe even having AI look for human allies if being beaten too badly...
...If Possible
Perhaps If there is a way to update the AI code or make some changes to the Trade Menu at a certain point, the AI and humans can make a decision to accept human players as allies or go to war against you, or in a pop up before going to war and running some military # and size comparisons the computer can ask you to join, or in the Victory Conditions Option, if it can be seen the size and # of ships and enemy has, and, if at all possible decide to ask to be an ally? Maybe even different "likeability" ratings to see if a Klingon would join a human, or if you have been aggressively expanding by them or attacking them, they hate you more and join anyone who want to go to war with you?
Anyhow, the thought being that you could have wars break out over resources and peaces be negotiated if necessary with anyone. Variable diplomatic fields. And with all this bieng dependent on something like Alert Status, one ship on red alert could make a bad situation erupt.
Maybe this is too complex for the AI abilities...I don’t know, but they a just some ideas I wanted to share. I don’t know if they are all possible or possible AT ALL.... 
But I do Hope!
Also, as far as tansporting and taking over other ships and stations, make it possible to use a 'stolen' ship/station in many covert ways.
An option to make it still look as if the race it came from is still using it, to add to intrigue and finger pointing? Make it an option, something like the miner/construction button the Dominion vessels have.... Appear as alien race the ship is from, or fly as the home team as it is in 3.0 now? 
Also, if it is flying as the race who made it, maybe your own ships on Red Alert may just destroy your undercover agents?
>:(
Maybe even add a option for races of the same ship type to do a security check on a ship to see who is flying it. However, make it so a Federation can verify a Federation ship 100% of the time but not verify a Klingon ship as well, and a Romulan ship even less, but maybe a Borg really easily, since Borg are the only ones who can "really" fly those ships... Or a Klingon can't tell a Federation as easily as a Romulan can, being a worse undercover or covert agent than a Romulan and a Romulan being all covert ops masters in a way...(maybe a 40% for K & 60% for R on verification of a Federation ship, or some likewise fair or balanced dividing lines for each race...Likewise, a Romulan might be 80% likely [when AI] to try to "dupe" another race (and more successful when flying others ships). For Example: a Romulan might especially like baiting a Human playing as the Federation or Klingon to get them to go to war with each other! While a a Borg would never be duped or try to dupe, using scans and assimilation tactics. A Dominion, use a dupe tactic? You bet! They did have the changeling founders who were fairly xenophobic, right? Maybe that makes them even more likely to use this tactic than the Romulans...
And, of course, have it as a Random option in the Options menu, RANDOM AI Personalities, or something, so you can have it on or off for cannon play or who-knows-who whould send a ship on Random sttings...
Then, lets consider Avatars:
a Klingon like Martok may be 40% likely to be covert, while the other Avatar, Taqroga might be more under-handed like the Duras sisters and 60% likely to use covert tactics, etc, etc. for all other races and avatars.
Essentially 2 breakdowns, 1] Is the race likely to be covert and steal ships and 2] is the Avatar a straight military commander or a somewhat covert planner?
Also, use it as more of a special weapon energy option only on certain ships or stations that have this "verification ability", maybe only certain vessels, sensor platforms or even research stations, in the same way tachyon scans on small ships and bases are now, etc...
And assuming the AI would try to use the other players ships in such resourceful and covert ways, otherwise all this only matters in the world of Multiplayer.... 
Anyhow, all this, if possible, would add a whole bunch of options to starting conflicts and going to war with your future "enemies". It would allow more covert options to make others go to war. Also, it would make the Green and Yellow Alert Status carry more weight than they do now, allow for more of a large buildup of AI forces before the conflict erupt, depth to winning via war or waiting till the dust settles...And it would prevent a ALL AND ALWAYS AT WAR feel, especially on the Instant Action vs. AI....which is how it is now.
My mouth is watering thinking of all the suspense at the option to go to war or realized you have been duped! and choices for Diplomacy that could be seen in the future . Please consider it for future versions... And keep up the great work!
AND on behalf of future dreamers, Thanks!
For starters, with the ARMADA 1 idea of starting all players neutral and even starting at green alert across the boards. Then only going to war by choice via Trade Menu Options or by Alert Status and, therefore, attack actions of your ships, you could really make a lot of outcome changes, and AI choices per game for very different outcomes. Maybe even having AI look for human allies if being beaten too badly...
...If Possible
Perhaps If there is a way to update the AI code or make some changes to the Trade Menu at a certain point, the AI and humans can make a decision to accept human players as allies or go to war against you, or in a pop up before going to war and running some military # and size comparisons the computer can ask you to join, or in the Victory Conditions Option, if it can be seen the size and # of ships and enemy has, and, if at all possible decide to ask to be an ally? Maybe even different "likeability" ratings to see if a Klingon would join a human, or if you have been aggressively expanding by them or attacking them, they hate you more and join anyone who want to go to war with you?
Anyhow, the thought being that you could have wars break out over resources and peaces be negotiated if necessary with anyone. Variable diplomatic fields. And with all this bieng dependent on something like Alert Status, one ship on red alert could make a bad situation erupt.
Maybe this is too complex for the AI abilities...I don’t know, but they a just some ideas I wanted to share. I don’t know if they are all possible or possible AT ALL....
But I do Hope!Also, as far as tansporting and taking over other ships and stations, make it possible to use a 'stolen' ship/station in many covert ways.
An option to make it still look as if the race it came from is still using it, to add to intrigue and finger pointing? Make it an option, something like the miner/construction button the Dominion vessels have.... Appear as alien race the ship is from, or fly as the home team as it is in 3.0 now? Also, if it is flying as the race who made it, maybe your own ships on Red Alert may just destroy your undercover agents?
>:( Maybe even add a option for races of the same ship type to do a security check on a ship to see who is flying it. However, make it so a Federation can verify a Federation ship 100% of the time but not verify a Klingon ship as well, and a Romulan ship even less, but maybe a Borg really easily, since Borg are the only ones who can "really" fly those ships... Or a Klingon can't tell a Federation as easily as a Romulan can, being a worse undercover or covert agent than a Romulan and a Romulan being all covert ops masters in a way...(maybe a 40% for K & 60% for R on verification of a Federation ship, or some likewise fair or balanced dividing lines for each race...Likewise, a Romulan might be 80% likely [when AI] to try to "dupe" another race (and more successful when flying others ships). For Example: a Romulan might especially like baiting a Human playing as the Federation or Klingon to get them to go to war with each other! While a a Borg would never be duped or try to dupe, using scans and assimilation tactics. A Dominion, use a dupe tactic? You bet! They did have the changeling founders who were fairly xenophobic, right? Maybe that makes them even more likely to use this tactic than the Romulans...
And, of course, have it as a Random option in the Options menu, RANDOM AI Personalities, or something, so you can have it on or off for cannon play or who-knows-who whould send a ship on Random sttings...
Then, lets consider Avatars:
a Klingon like Martok may be 40% likely to be covert, while the other Avatar, Taqroga might be more under-handed like the Duras sisters and 60% likely to use covert tactics, etc, etc. for all other races and avatars.
Essentially 2 breakdowns, 1] Is the race likely to be covert and steal ships and 2] is the Avatar a straight military commander or a somewhat covert planner?
Also, use it as more of a special weapon energy option only on certain ships or stations that have this "verification ability", maybe only certain vessels, sensor platforms or even research stations, in the same way tachyon scans on small ships and bases are now, etc...
And assuming the AI would try to use the other players ships in such resourceful and covert ways, otherwise all this only matters in the world of Multiplayer....
Anyhow, all this, if possible, would add a whole bunch of options to starting conflicts and going to war with your future "enemies". It would allow more covert options to make others go to war. Also, it would make the Green and Yellow Alert Status carry more weight than they do now, allow for more of a large buildup of AI forces before the conflict erupt, depth to winning via war or waiting till the dust settles...And it would prevent a ALL AND ALWAYS AT WAR feel, especially on the Instant Action vs. AI....which is how it is now.
My mouth is watering thinking of all the suspense at the option to go to war or realized you have been duped! and choices for Diplomacy that could be seen in the future . Please consider it for future versions... And keep up the great work!
AND on behalf of future dreamers, Thanks!
posted on November 30th, 2008, 7:30 pm
ray320
posted on November 30th, 2008, 8:51 pm
posted on December 1st, 2008, 8:34 pm
Yes, I understand the Civ idea (and I am a fan of that as well) but I started this thread for the Mod folks as an idea that was an expansion from the original Armada (as well as that Romulan level in A2). My thought being it may be a good fit for a future version of Fleet Ops, and I hope it is possible.
But, I will leave it to the geniuses who desinged this (Fleet Ops), so hopefully we dont have to get activision involed again!
lol
But, I will leave it to the geniuses who desinged this (Fleet Ops), so hopefully we dont have to get activision involed again!
lolWho is online
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