Improvements on the Dominion Warmachine

posted on January 1st, 2011, 6:55 pm

Yes, the B'rel gets an additional (described) passive which reduces the effect that Tactical has

TaQ's B'rels may miss with their torps, but S-2's torpedo: beam damage ratio is also considerably higher for the Torpedo. That on top of the fact that the pulses are dealing ~20% more base damage than beams makes the B'rel a fearsome opponent. 

From a quick glance it appears that Dodecahedron against the Attack Destroyer is the strongest counter, with roughly 181% increased effectiveness.

posted on January 1st, 2011, 7:02 pm

Yes, the B'rel gets an additional (described) passive which reduces the effect that Tactical has

another passive? the guide says it has TWA and manual targetting, but manual targetting doesnt influence anything here. what is the passive called?

makes the B'rel a fearsome opponent. 

i stand corrected

From a quick glance it appears that Dodecahedron against the Attack Destroyer is the strongest counter, with roughly 181% increased effectiveness.

thats probably due to the adapted torp doing more to smalls right? how much extra damage is it for a bug?

posted on January 1st, 2011, 7:12 pm

213% increased damage to a bug 

Yeah, the guide automatically takes into consideration the 'extra' passive (that's why it says 12%, not 24% there)  - it's really just within the text of Manual Targeting if you take a close look (says something like 50% reduction of negative effects of the ranged passive, and then repeats it by showing only a -12% weakness to shorties).

If we're going to discuss more damage calculations however, we should open a new topic I think 

posted on January 1st, 2011, 7:17 pm

The Bomber should do less damage to an officer rank B'rel due to the Extended Destroyer Cores. 16% increased damage caused, 16% reduced damage taken from other destroyers.

posted on January 1st, 2011, 9:19 pm

Yeah, the guide automatically takes into consideration the 'extra' passive (that's why it says 12%, not 24% there)  - it's really just within the text of Manual Targeting if you take a close look (says something like 50% reduction of negative effects of the ranged passive, and then repeats it by showing only a -12% weakness to shorties).

the manual targetting description in game mentions that, but the manual targetting description in the brel database entry doesnt mention the resistance to range based passives.

perhaps the description of manual targetting should be added to the damage system list of passives, since several ships now have it.

posted on January 1st, 2011, 10:27 pm

A better system of tooltip descriptions will be added to the new database when it becomes operational - for now however, I think it serves its purpose, as it does give the necessary information (even if it doesn't give it exactly as how it is  in-game). Manual Targeting is technically a passive only on a single vessel (the B'rel), because the Vutpa' does not have any weakness created by a passive. It's a bit too difficult for me to go through each and every unit manually and add in the exact wording as they read in-game at the moment, for an already defunct system  .

posted on January 2nd, 2011, 1:06 am

but i trust that whenever a ship with a passive that has a negative also has manual targetting, that the negative will be less severe?

so a vet vorcha gets manual targetting, but it also has ablative armour, so instead of a 10% damage penalty against LR it gets a smaller damage penalty? or is it only the brel that gets a benefit?

also would the vet luspet suffer less from its adai?

posted on January 2nd, 2011, 3:10 am

As near as I can tell, only the B'rel is granted this effect, as that was the original goal of the implementation. I could be wrong, but I am sadly out of time. In three weeks I may have another answer for you 

posted on January 2nd, 2011, 12:52 pm

i just went in game and checked, the tooltips say that all the ships that get manual targeting (even as a result of battle tried energy circuits on vet rank) get a reduction in negatives from their passives.

so for the brel it always has manual targeting, and as we know it gets 12% penalty against SR instead of 24%

the vutpa always has manual targeting, but its passive (targeting scrambler) has no negative effects, the tooltip for manual targeting still mentions the 50% bonus to passives though.

the vorcha gets manual targeting at vet, and instead of 10% penalty against LR it gets 5% penalty.

the chonaq gets manual targeting at vet, but has no passive to worry about, again like vutpa the tooltip still mentions the 50% improved efficiency.

the luspet gets manual targeting at vet, and its ADAI is greatly improved by manual targeting. instead of doing ~60% less damage to supports, it does ~30% less, and instead of taking ~25% more it takes ~12% more. thats pretty significant. i guess its ok anyway, since this is only the vet luspet we are talking about, which is already pretty nice.

it seems manual targeting always grants 50% reduction of negative effects from a ship's passives.

GLORY TO THE EMPIRE, QAPLA

posted on January 3rd, 2011, 3:25 pm

I did not get to have a real look at this thread for a while. Nice to see something similar to my idea is planned. However I am a bit uneasy how this thread got derailed.

So can I just have a quick vote who likes what with my idea? And once I get the vote you can go back to your off topic discussion. 

posted on January 7th, 2011, 4:39 am

I did not get to have a real look at this thread for a while. Nice to see something similar to my idea is planned. However I am a bit uneasy how this thread got derailed.

So can I just have a quick vote who likes what with my idea? And once I get the vote you can go back to your off topic discussion. 

i would personally say its not needed. dominion are already very strong and if they get a proxy yard up on at least 2 popular maps they can game over you quickly. also dom have a strong late game due to the fact they can mine supply. other races have supply as a soft limit to the max ships they can field, since the dom don't have that they can put out more ships in the late game.