Cardassian Vessel proposal

posted on November 1st, 2010, 2:57 pm

The Cardassians are going to be added as a NPC in the future.

With the known existing classes such as the Galor, Keldon and Hideki perhaps these classes from DS9 Dominion Wars can be added:

Ship Profile Norin - DS9: Dominion Wars

Ship Profile Tonga - DS9: Dominion Wars

Hutet - DS9: Dominion Wars

posted on November 1st, 2010, 3:01 pm

The Norin and Tonga Class would be great additions. The Norin in particular looks like it could be built in minimal time and cost, which would be useful to them.

The Hutet I also like, but it doesn't look like something they could afford in the Unions current condition.

posted on November 1st, 2010, 3:31 pm

I remember the Hutet from the game Dominion Wars. I loved that ship, most cardassian ships are all a blur of the same with the front and tail somewhat. But that ship, at least she was a giant, and still looked kinda nice, at least to me.

But yes, I agree with the previous post... being able to afford a ship like that, who knows. But it is a nice ship.

posted on November 1st, 2010, 3:39 pm

I think they would make great NPC's.  A hutet would make a very nice map race object. 

posted on November 1st, 2010, 4:23 pm

I think they would make great NPC's.  A hutet would make a very nice map race object.  

I don't think the FO-Cardassians would have any of their own left after the war.

The Hutet I also like, but it doesn't look like something they could afford in the Unions current condition.

I don't think it's an issue, Tyler.
If the NPC-races and interaction-features are going to be at least similar to the Warcraft III mercenary-camps, goblin laboratories and such, you as a player fund them with resources. So if there's a cardassian yard on the map, you fund them to build the ship you want (whatever "blueprints" are available). And I personally hope that the NPC-system will be that way when it comes to "mercenary-ships".

posted on November 1st, 2010, 4:30 pm

Not a very convincing argument. Being funded by a player is irrelevent; the Cardassians are a crippled Union that is still recovering by FO canon. They cannot afford to build a Hutet and the game reflects that, exactly the same as how rare or experimental ships are capped rather than simply expensive.

You are hiring mercenaries, not hiring and rebuilding an Empire. Assuming you can even build, since you're not playing a Cardassian faction.

posted on November 1st, 2010, 4:36 pm

Lol Tyler, I think he's just saying that "the Cardassians could ever afford a ship like that" is an argument that is arbitrarily limiting  .  If the ship class is one that looks like it fits well and does suck totally, why rationalize it away with silly things like cost?



  There are lots of ways to rationalize it IN.  If it's NPC then it can be whatever we/devs want it to be .  Secret project maybe.  Consolidated design (F-35 Multi-purpose Strike Fighter vs. F-22 Raptor for example).  Why pay for two expensive designs when you can make one that does both for only slightly more?

posted on November 1st, 2010, 6:13 pm

looks gr8,and enjoyed the look of all ships,i think cardassians shud feature in game as playable,maybe a builind limit like romulans tavara fot the planet killing ship,still looks awesome thou

posted on November 1st, 2010, 6:19 pm

Lol Tyler, I think he's just saying that "the Cardassians could ever afford a ship like that" is an argument that is arbitrarily limiting  .  If the ship class is one that looks like it fits well and does suck totally, why rationalize it away with silly things like cost?

His post sounds more like putting gameplay (players can collect resources to build it, then build it themselves) before the storyline (Cardassians are more resource starved than ever and cannot fund it).

It looks (to me, at least) as more of a post saying 'screw storyline, gameplay is all that counts'.

[RedEyedRaven]

posted on November 1st, 2010, 6:22 pm

Last edited by RedEyedRaven on November 1st, 2010, 6:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

His post sounds more like putting gameplay (players can collect resources to build it, then build it themselves) before the storyline (Cardassians are more resource starved than ever and cannot fund it).

It looks (to me, at least) as more of a post saying 'screw storyline, gameplay is all that counts'.

I really don't know why you did ignore the line about "like the mercenary-camps and goblin laboratories in Warcraft III"... Imagine there's a neutral cardassian yard on the map, Tyler. Imagine they sell and build stuff to those who fund them. And now imagine they use the profits out of that business to help rebuilding Cardassia.

Got it this time?

posted on November 1st, 2010, 6:37 pm

It looks (to me, at least) as more of a post saying 'screw storyline, gameplay is all that counts'.

I've never botherd to learn the fleetops storyline, nor do I plan to due to the lack of a SP campaign.

If a mod is purely MP, storyline is rather pointless.


As for the Hutet, add it, but make it very limited like the Tavara.

I'd say do the Avatars for cardies like this

Gul Dukat: focus is on manuver units up to Galor class. Ships rely on tactics. Largest ship avalivle w/o limit is the Galor, limited number of Keldon's are buildable.

Obsidian Order: focus is on large ships overpowering the enemy. Hutet can be built, up to three, Keldons can be built in unlimited numbers, however smaller escort ships are limited.


Basicly, one side relies on being able to react fast, the other relies on smashing resistence.

posted on November 1st, 2010, 6:42 pm

There will be SP campains in the future, just not until after MP is finished.

Gul Dukat is dead and there is no Obsidion Order (also dead).

I really don't know why you did ignore the line about "like the mercenary-camps and goblin laboratories in Warcraft III"... Imagine there's a neutral cardassian yard on the map, Tyler. Imagine they sell and build stuff to those who fund them. And now imagine they use the profits out of that business to help rebuilding Cardassia.

Got it this time?

They would have to have rebuilt to the level that they don't need help to be capable of even considering a Hutet. The resources and manpower required to build something like it would reduce production of other things, giving them less to sell for profit (feels weird mentioning that about non-Ferengi).

There would no doubt be a larger pool of buyers for the smaller, cheaper ships like the Hideki or Galor than a hulking behemoth anyway.

I see what you're getting at (profit to help rebuild is probably the reason they work for others already), I just don't think it's worth it to attempt getting profit from something like a Hutet. I'd prefer it as a map object that survived the war.

posted on November 1st, 2010, 6:55 pm

I've never botherd to learn the fleetops storyline, nor do I plan to due to the lack of a SP campaign.

If a mod is purely MP, storyline is rather pointless.

You know... if you don't know the FO-storyline and never bothered to read the apocrypha-section of the guide (which explains the important parts of the FO-storyline) you should really do that. May there be a campaign done or not.

The only thing in MP where story is pointless is when it comes to things like "federation and Borg together in a team" and such things. For the factions themselves and their avatars (gameplay), the story explains for example why Taq'Roja uses artillery vessels and why Risner is so specialised with big ships.

It also explains why Cardassians won't be playable as a faction and not even as a semi-faction.

There would no doubt be a larger pool of buyers for the smaller, cheaper ships like the Hideki or Galor than a hulking behemoth anyway.

However I do tend to think they don't have much of a choice. If my planet would lay in ashes and I'd still have at least a few shipyards somewhere I'd be happy to sell whatever I can. Cardassian pride? Not anymore, I'd say.

posted on November 1st, 2010, 7:07 pm

The resources and manpower required to build something like it would reduce production of other things, giving them less to sell for profit

Hence my basic idea for the two avatars. One focuses on galor spam, the other focuses on more powerful larger ships, but at a limited number.

Fact is that they could easily build and maintain the thing, however it would lower the number of new ships built while its being constructed, and would take enough crew to normaly staff quite a few more ships.

[Tyler]

posted on November 1st, 2010, 7:16 pm

Last edited by Tyler on November 1st, 2010, 7:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

They have no avatars. No NPC will.

You've never actually seen the thing, have you? The Galaxy is too large and expensive to be built often while also requiring a heavy construction crew, the Hutet is far bigger and used by a race that was very resource poor from the start (having a very small crew pool due to attempted genocide doesn't help).

The Hutet is the Cardassian version of the Jem'Hadar Dreadnought.