Boarding, Crew and Stations

[Zebh]

posted on May 27th, 2010, 12:22 pm

Last edited by Zebh on May 27th, 2010, 12:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

First idea is about crew levels on ships. Currently the maximum amount of crew is static and can never go over the maximum cap and ships leave the yards this way. I think that the maximum amount of crew aboard shouldn't be the same which the ship leaves the yard. Ships are big and they are known to be able to support higher crew than they do in FO right now (Intrepid, Galaxy and I think Negh'var and D'deridex can do better too). I think that the ship could have extra crew transported, but when over crewed, the ship would get high causalities when weapon hits, so no one could just keep them over crewed without price. The ships would get the optimal crew when visiting yard, so extra crew would be automatically be removed. This over crewing could also increase the repair rate, so getting the helpless ships without engines or life support would be much easier. This kind of extra crew wouldn't of course need to apply to the Borg, as they already have high crew counts on their ships.

Currently the boarding in FO is very simple, the boarded troops will always decrease the amount of the original crew till the crew count goes zero. So basically one boarder will kill one crew member and then get killed (typical situation).

The idea I have in mind would be that the ships could have "more than one crew at the same time". The ships and stations could have the boarders as second crew (some red text field below the current crew to indicate hostiles on board). The boarding behavior would also be somewhat to different to current one to one logic. As the boarders first board the unit, they would get the advantage of surprise and in the first second the defending crew causalities would be higher. As the ratio between boarders and defenders changes, the causalities will be higher on the side having less crew. When the amount of either group is below certain percentage of the other crew (15% perhaps), the causalities of that side get very small. If the original crew level drops below that percentage of boarder crew the ship will switch sides as that side would be able to gain control of the main systems. The crew left would sabotage the ship, so engines or weapons might go off-line for a long time if yard visit isn't performed. But as long there is the crew of the other side, the other ships won't fire on it. The crew causalities should also happen in bursts more than in linear way. And when the amount of causalities is slightly randomized it would allow more interesting outcomes for the boarding.

Another thing that I find odd in Armada is the way how stations get re-crewed. If they aren't under an attack they just open doors and new crew rushes in? I think the re-crew for stations should be more like requesting for more crew, and then the station would get a certain amount of crew in intervals, not in a steady flow. If the station gets attacked before a replacement crew arrives, only the next crew would arrive and the next interval wouldn't begin until the attack ends.

The current stations aren't really ever boarded as it is so risky that destroying the station is much better alternative. It isn't so nice when it is some special NPC station, as it would get just destroyed or decommissioned as no one isn't really interested to have the trouble of boarding it. So the next idea is mainly for NPC map object stations. The stations would have possibility to abandon. By abandoning station the player would get some resources and if upgrades done, then too. The resources would come as flow in certain time and if enemy manages to board the station before the time ends, the player won't get as much as he would otherwise. When player have decided to abandon the station, it will become derelict if no one boards or is boarding it when all crew are gone. When new player takes abandoned station, it wouldn't have weapons or shields and the subsystems would have random short failures before some resources invested in. The upgrades would enable race's specific shields, remove subsystem failures and add weaponry, increase hull armor etc. Each of those could be as own upgrade. The derelict stations on maps could be as abandoned by default, so the player wouldn't just get a free defensive position, as it would be require upgrades before it is any help.

It would also be nice if the transporter capacity could be ship specific, as bigger ships probably have more transporter rooms too. I know it isn't easy to change, but it would certainly a nice update.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 12:28 pm

good ideas, my support for this

posted on May 27th, 2010, 12:31 pm

Can't say much else other than that I like it - would be interesting to see what the devs can incorporate from this and use in future patches

posted on May 27th, 2010, 12:33 pm

Crew being capable of going higher than the starting level, I agree with. The ships do have a lot more space than they're using.

Seperate crew counter for intruders, I agree with. That one could be tough, though.

Station recrew, I also agree with. The standard is like they're getting a bucket and pouring the crew in.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 2:25 pm

These are definitely good ideas.  Some would probably be difficult to implement, but they would definitely be a great addition to the game.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:05 pm

Agreed. One thing to add might be that non-Borg stations (except for starbases) start out with no crew . The logic being that you made a station with replicators, and the crew is going to have to come over and get in the recently built station, rather than the current system of "when the station is built, people magically appear."

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:08 pm

I think that the crew is requested for the station at the point when building begins and the crew arrives when the station isn't completely finished.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:08 pm

that's an interesting and realistic idea lol. instead of having to manually beam over and crew the station, maybe an npc unctrollable transport can warp in and deliver the crew. so the enemy could shoot it down and you would have to wait 60 seconds for the next ship to be available, or transport yourself lol

EDIT: ninjad by zebh

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:14 pm

I think that the crew is requested for the station at the point when building begins and the crew arrives when the station isn't completely finished.

But they can't arrive instantaneously, that's just weird.

that's an interesting and realistic idea lol. instead of having to manually beam over and crew the station, maybe an npc unctrollable transport can warp in and deliver the crew. so the enemy could shoot it down and you would have to wait 60 seconds for the next ship to be available, or transport yourself lol

EDIT: ninjad by zebh

That would be a good (and realtrekistic) way to implement my idea. Maybe have a really old warship do it, one no longer fit for frontline service. Civilian ships would also work, but with it being so close to the frontlines and the enemy might attack I think the ships would need at least some defences. Shuttles could work too, but you'd need a lot of them for some stations, and they'd be cannon-fodder.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:19 pm

that's an interesting and realistic idea lol. instead of having to manually beam over and crew the station, maybe an npc unctrollable transport can warp in and deliver the crew. so the enemy could shoot it down and you would have to wait 60 seconds for the next ship to be available, or transport yourself lol

EDIT: ninjad by zebh

dont agree with this idea, can be exploited way too easily.

First idea is about crew levels on ships. Currently the maximum amount of crew is static and can never go over the maximum cap and ships leave the yards this way. I think that the maximum amount of crew aboard shouldn't be the same which the ship leaves the yard. Ships are big and they are known to be able to support higher crew than they do in FO right now (Intrepid, Galaxy and I think Negh'var and D'deridex can do better too). I think that the ship could have extra crew transported, but when over crewed, the ship would get high causalities when weapon hits, so no one could just keep them over crewed without price. The ships would get the optimal crew when visiting yard, so extra crew would be automatically be removed. This over crewing could also increase the repair rate, so getting the helpless ships without engines or life support would be much easier. This kind of extra crew wouldn't of course need to apply to the Borg, as they already have high crew counts on their ships.

Currently the boarding in FO is very simple, the boarded troops will always decrease the amount of the original crew till the crew count goes zero. So basically one boarder will kill one crew member and then get killed (typical situation).

The idea I have in mind would be that the ships could have "more than one crew at the same time". The ships and stations could have the boarders as second crew (some red text field below the current crew to indicate hostiles on board). The boarding behavior would also be somewhat to different to current one to one logic. As the boarders first board the unit, they would get the advantage of surprise and in the first second the defending crew causalities would be higher. As the ratio between boarders and defenders changes, the causalities will be higher on the side having less crew. When the amount of either group is below certain percentage of the other crew (15% perhaps), the causalities of that side get very small. If the original crew level drops below that percentage of boarder crew the ship will switch sides as that side would be able to gain control of the main systems. The crew left would sabotage the ship, so engines or weapons might go off-line for a long time if yard visit isn't performed. But as long there is the crew of the other side, the other ships won't fire on it. The crew causalities should also happen in bursts more than in linear way. And when the amount of causalities is slightly randomized it would allow more interesting outcomes for the boarding.

Another thing that I find odd in Armada is the way how stations get re-crewed. If they aren't under an attack they just open doors and new crew rushes in? I think the re-crew for stations should be more like requesting for more crew, and then the station would get a certain amount of crew in intervals, not in a steady flow. If the station gets attacked before a replacement crew arrives, only the next crew would arrive and the next interval wouldn't begin until the attack ends.

The current stations aren't really ever boarded as it is so risky that destroying the station is much better alternative. It isn't so nice when it is some special NPC station, as it would get just destroyed or decommissioned as no one isn't really interested to have the trouble of boarding it. So the next idea is mainly for NPC map object stations. The stations would have possibility to abandon. By abandoning station the player would get some resources and if upgrades done, then too. The resources would come as flow in certain time and if enemy manages to board the station before the time ends, the player won't get as much as he would otherwise. When player have decided to abandon the station, it will become derelict if no one boards or is boarding it when all crew are gone. When new player takes abandoned station, it wouldn't have weapons or shields and the subsystems would have random short failures before some resources invested in. The upgrades would enable race's specific shields, remove subsystem failures and add weaponry, increase hull armor etc. Each of those could be as own upgrade. The derelict stations on maps could be as abandoned by default, so the player wouldn't just get a free defensive position, as it would be require upgrades before it is any help.

It would also be nice if the transporter capacity could be ship specific, as bigger ships probably have more transporter rooms too. I know it isn't easy to change, but it would certainly a nice update.

sounds reasonable .

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:23 pm

Exploited how? You mean by the enemy with their cloaked ships suddenly transporting over to the station? Maybe the station could start with shields up so that enemies can't transport aboard. If you want it crewed immediately you could send some people from the constructor ship that built it over.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:27 pm

exploited that the enemy could destroy the transport before its arrived, negating the idea or use the ability to transport over while the stations shields are down from the transports ships beam over.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:46 pm

The transport would have weapons, also you really should have a fleet to protect your stuff. As far as the enemy beaming while you're beaming:
a). Bring a fleet to kill nearby enemy ships
b). If enemy ships are cloaked bring in some cloak detection too

If your enemy has ships for boarding your station and they're nearby, then they board the station right as you begin boarding it yourself, with larger boarding parties than you, then they're obviously doing something called strategy.

posted on May 27th, 2010, 3:54 pm

It still seems a bit odd.  I think if this is implemented ships should just warp-in, beam the crew over, and warp out without becoming targettable (like the current warp-in ships before they're controlable).  Newly-built stations should start with the appropriate crew, because if you're building something over a period of time, logically you'd call for the crew to be there, ready for duty, once it's done being built.

[Nebula_Class_Ftw]

posted on May 27th, 2010, 4:07 pm

Last edited by Nebula_Class_Ftw on May 27th, 2010, 4:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

I think that they should be targetable, but be really fast at getting the hell out of there (7 seconds tops, and they would begin transporting immediately.)

I don't think the station should have crew instantly, people couldn't be in the stations while they're building (dangerous due to lack of atmosphere and no shields), so they shouldn't arrive on the stations until after the stations are built.

Think of it this way: when you begin building that station, a subspace message is sent to Starfleet (or whatever military depending on the race you're playing) to send a transport containing the personnel, that transport warps in there shortly after the station finishes, taking 5-7 seconds to transport people aboard the station (maybe longer for stations with higher crew counts), then it warps out.
The transport would beam over a larger number of crew per second than other ships due to it being highly specialized for this task, so no need to worry about a few ships trying to board your station (a bunch of ships might be a problem though.)

EDIT: sorry if this has gone a bit too off-topic.