3.13-3.20 Warp-in Poll
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posted on June 30th, 2010, 3:20 pm
Last edited by Anonymous on June 30th, 2010, 3:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I was thinking about a possible entry of some new warp-ins somewhere between 3.13 and 3.20. Basically for designs that may not be often known amongst all I've attached an image to give a perspective of it. I was thinking that these designs would easily fit the warp-in role since their dominant appearences (if at all) were in the TNG era or earlier. Here is how I imagined that these ships would be like:
Apollo Class:
Classification: Light Cruiser
Offensive Value: 16
Defensive Value: 26
System Vaule: 12
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Photon Torpedo
- Anti-Torpedo Defense System (Range: Dogfight; This is a balanced version of the PDL system on the stock nebula that many wondered if it would ever return. You start out with a 40% chance of destroying an incoming torpedo, and as you rank up your defense chance increases, finalizing at a 70% chance at veteran rank. There is still however the chance of failure which is needed for sake of balance. Each shot will cost 60 energy, but after rank 4 then the energy cost will begin to decrease, at veteran being reduced to 48 energy per shot, not much, but it will certainly give an extra shot or two before depletion.)
Information:
Other than its re-introducing of the Point-Defense-Laser. It also has some other significant role. It would act as a support ship or defensive ship because of this. It has fairly good speed to help respond quickly to areas that need an extra hand in combat, and has a passive that allows it to deal increased damage to ships with torpedo weaponry (featured in a few other ships, where they target torpedo bays to deal increased damage, and sometimes disable weapons), but of course decreased to those without. As most would say that this would become an anti-torpedo ship. It also has another passive where its old shields are more vulnerable to torpedoes and pulses, but receive slightly decreased damage from beams.
Constant Class:
Classification: Destroyer
Offensive Value: 11
Defensive Value: 16
System Value: 7
Range: Short
Armament:
- Phaser
- Experimental Photon Torpedo (This torpedo deals increased damage to Cruisers and Heavy Cruisers, but deals one third less damage to battleships and stations)
Information:
This is a destroyer aimed to take on cruisers, specifically helpful mid-game when it is mostly cruisers (Akiras, Intrepids, Nebulas, Galaxies, Griffins, Generix, Sang, Chargh, Escort Cruisers, Warfrigates, and so on) and heavy cruisers (Excel IIs, T-15s, Vor'chas, Vutpa's, LuSpet, Eresis, Cehlaer, and so on). Most of these of course would deal plenty of damage to waste this ship away, though with the right microing, you can turn this ship into a useful tool. To help ranking it pay off, I was thinking why not add a Weapon Refit passive at rank 4 (this passive allows occasional extra torpedoes to fire, often having the same properties as the others), it won't turn this ship into a power house, and it would also help strategically.
Melbourne Type:
Classification: Medium Cruiser
Offensive Value: 26
Defensive Value: 30
System Value: 16
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Photon Torpedo
Information:
The Melbourne Type is a ship I always thought of as a high speed attack cruiser, the speed of a destroyer, the teeth of a cruiser. Now of course it already seems OP right? Well, to balance it out, I have a little set of passives to help around. First would be a passive where Destroyers with special engines (or faster speeds) have a 15% hit chance reduction from its torpedoes. Also the torpedoes will deal 10% less damage to scouts, destroyers, and light cruisers. This is all because it is a quick fire ship. And quick fire ships don't always hit the target as much. So this ship would be good for late game with reguards to offense. However, another passive defines that its hull receives 20% less damage from destroyers, and 12% from cruisers. Also it receives 8% increased damage from stations, making it not the perfect raid ship. The choice is yours on its exact role, all I'm saying is that it has the speed that would make it count as a raid ship.
Constellation Class:
Classification: Heavy Destroyer
Offensive Value: 17
Defensive Value: 24
System Value: 10
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Type II Photon Torpedoes (Deals Half damage to large targets, deals double damage to small targets)
- Change to Type I Photon Torpedoes (This changes the armament from Type II to Type I torpedoes. Type I torpedoes will deal 50% more damage to large targets, but hit chance towards small targets is cut by half because of outdated guidance systems.)
Information:
Other than the all similar ability compared to the Galaxy Type III torpedoes, this has the ability to switch from Anti-Destroyer mode to a station bombardment mode. Type I torpedoes have a slower shot rate, but still deal more dps. But towards small craft, the Type I torpedoes are strongly not recommended because of hit chances cut by half. Which to anyone knows that it is not that good. There is also a 40 second cooldown for the toggle ability. However, the cooldown time slowly reduces as you rank.
Centaur Class:
Classification: Light Destroyer
Offensive Value: 17
Defensive Value: 15
System Value: 6
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Bi-Colbalt Torpedo (Special Ability: Fires a long range torpedo, deals an additional 80% damage to most stations, but deals 20% less damage towards long ranged ships and 40% less damage to artillery ranged ships. Also deals 8% more damage at Dominion Targets)
Information:
This is a simple Destroyer armed with an outdated artillery weapon. Because of the fact that many races are familiar with its artillery weapon, it does not deal much damage. However, it is very effective against Dominion structures because of these weapons being quite new against this Gamma Quadrant race. However, a lot of the newer designs have been adapted to stand against these artillery weapons, making it almost obsolete. Other than its flawful Artillery torpedo, this ship does have incredible speed (Equivalent to the Hyper Impulse Saber). This speed allows it to track down enemy destroyers and be less likely to be out-run by its target. This ship Gains a Photon Torpedo at Rank 5, and Bi-Colbalt torpedoes are replaced with Modified Tri-Colbalt torpedoes at Veteran Rank. The Modified Tri-Colbalts will not deal as much damage as that from the Steamrunner or from the Intrepid. It would however make the ship even more effective in attacks against enemy stations.
Well, those are the choices, laid out in nice detail. Now , of course, you can choose any two ships you'd like. I'm sure that most people wouldn't want more than two of these. Now, I'd be open to suggestions on somethings that could make the ships more balanced. Since this is a request thread for features in a future patch. I would also like to hear an opinion from one or more of the devs, to see what they like and don't like about this. And also whether or not there will be more expanding of the might warp-in system.
I look forward to opinions and criticism. And I hope everyone looks at this with an open mind.
Apollo Class:
Classification: Light Cruiser
Offensive Value: 16
Defensive Value: 26
System Vaule: 12
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Photon Torpedo
- Anti-Torpedo Defense System (Range: Dogfight; This is a balanced version of the PDL system on the stock nebula that many wondered if it would ever return. You start out with a 40% chance of destroying an incoming torpedo, and as you rank up your defense chance increases, finalizing at a 70% chance at veteran rank. There is still however the chance of failure which is needed for sake of balance. Each shot will cost 60 energy, but after rank 4 then the energy cost will begin to decrease, at veteran being reduced to 48 energy per shot, not much, but it will certainly give an extra shot or two before depletion.)
Information:
Other than its re-introducing of the Point-Defense-Laser. It also has some other significant role. It would act as a support ship or defensive ship because of this. It has fairly good speed to help respond quickly to areas that need an extra hand in combat, and has a passive that allows it to deal increased damage to ships with torpedo weaponry (featured in a few other ships, where they target torpedo bays to deal increased damage, and sometimes disable weapons), but of course decreased to those without. As most would say that this would become an anti-torpedo ship. It also has another passive where its old shields are more vulnerable to torpedoes and pulses, but receive slightly decreased damage from beams.
Constant Class:
Classification: Destroyer
Offensive Value: 11
Defensive Value: 16
System Value: 7
Range: Short
Armament:
- Phaser
- Experimental Photon Torpedo (This torpedo deals increased damage to Cruisers and Heavy Cruisers, but deals one third less damage to battleships and stations)
Information:
This is a destroyer aimed to take on cruisers, specifically helpful mid-game when it is mostly cruisers (Akiras, Intrepids, Nebulas, Galaxies, Griffins, Generix, Sang, Chargh, Escort Cruisers, Warfrigates, and so on) and heavy cruisers (Excel IIs, T-15s, Vor'chas, Vutpa's, LuSpet, Eresis, Cehlaer, and so on). Most of these of course would deal plenty of damage to waste this ship away, though with the right microing, you can turn this ship into a useful tool. To help ranking it pay off, I was thinking why not add a Weapon Refit passive at rank 4 (this passive allows occasional extra torpedoes to fire, often having the same properties as the others), it won't turn this ship into a power house, and it would also help strategically.
Melbourne Type:
Classification: Medium Cruiser
Offensive Value: 26
Defensive Value: 30
System Value: 16
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Photon Torpedo
Information:
The Melbourne Type is a ship I always thought of as a high speed attack cruiser, the speed of a destroyer, the teeth of a cruiser. Now of course it already seems OP right? Well, to balance it out, I have a little set of passives to help around. First would be a passive where Destroyers with special engines (or faster speeds) have a 15% hit chance reduction from its torpedoes. Also the torpedoes will deal 10% less damage to scouts, destroyers, and light cruisers. This is all because it is a quick fire ship. And quick fire ships don't always hit the target as much. So this ship would be good for late game with reguards to offense. However, another passive defines that its hull receives 20% less damage from destroyers, and 12% from cruisers. Also it receives 8% increased damage from stations, making it not the perfect raid ship. The choice is yours on its exact role, all I'm saying is that it has the speed that would make it count as a raid ship.
Constellation Class:
Classification: Heavy Destroyer
Offensive Value: 17
Defensive Value: 24
System Value: 10
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Type II Photon Torpedoes (Deals Half damage to large targets, deals double damage to small targets)
- Change to Type I Photon Torpedoes (This changes the armament from Type II to Type I torpedoes. Type I torpedoes will deal 50% more damage to large targets, but hit chance towards small targets is cut by half because of outdated guidance systems.)
Information:
Other than the all similar ability compared to the Galaxy Type III torpedoes, this has the ability to switch from Anti-Destroyer mode to a station bombardment mode. Type I torpedoes have a slower shot rate, but still deal more dps. But towards small craft, the Type I torpedoes are strongly not recommended because of hit chances cut by half. Which to anyone knows that it is not that good. There is also a 40 second cooldown for the toggle ability. However, the cooldown time slowly reduces as you rank.
Centaur Class:
Classification: Light Destroyer
Offensive Value: 17
Defensive Value: 15
System Value: 6
Range: Medium
Armament:
- Phaser
- Bi-Colbalt Torpedo (Special Ability: Fires a long range torpedo, deals an additional 80% damage to most stations, but deals 20% less damage towards long ranged ships and 40% less damage to artillery ranged ships. Also deals 8% more damage at Dominion Targets)
Information:
This is a simple Destroyer armed with an outdated artillery weapon. Because of the fact that many races are familiar with its artillery weapon, it does not deal much damage. However, it is very effective against Dominion structures because of these weapons being quite new against this Gamma Quadrant race. However, a lot of the newer designs have been adapted to stand against these artillery weapons, making it almost obsolete. Other than its flawful Artillery torpedo, this ship does have incredible speed (Equivalent to the Hyper Impulse Saber). This speed allows it to track down enemy destroyers and be less likely to be out-run by its target. This ship Gains a Photon Torpedo at Rank 5, and Bi-Colbalt torpedoes are replaced with Modified Tri-Colbalt torpedoes at Veteran Rank. The Modified Tri-Colbalts will not deal as much damage as that from the Steamrunner or from the Intrepid. It would however make the ship even more effective in attacks against enemy stations.
Well, those are the choices, laid out in nice detail. Now , of course, you can choose any two ships you'd like. I'm sure that most people wouldn't want more than two of these. Now, I'd be open to suggestions on somethings that could make the ships more balanced. Since this is a request thread for features in a future patch. I would also like to hear an opinion from one or more of the devs, to see what they like and don't like about this. And also whether or not there will be more expanding of the might warp-in system.
I look forward to opinions and criticism. And I hope everyone looks at this with an open mind.
Attachments
posted on June 30th, 2010, 3:29 pm
i just like the first one b/c of point defense, i don't like the others... 
also the point defense better only work for that type of starship instead of covering an entire fleet..? o-o;
also the point defense better only work for that type of starship instead of covering an entire fleet..? o-o;
posted on June 30th, 2010, 3:30 pm
posted on June 30th, 2010, 3:48 pm
I think the Melbourne-type is ugly, I only like the look of the other two variants of the Nebula. So it's a fast anti-destroyer raiding ship that can't work as a raiding ship due to what happens when it comes up against stations? 
I also don't like the special engine idea, ECM is the only thing that makes torps miss.
I hate the Constant class 1) because its stats are near identical for offense and defense, totally not Federation design. 2) I don't like a torpedo that deals extra damage only to cruisers, I mean if making a destoyer bigger makes it take more damage from this torpedo, then making it even bigger should make it take more damage, not less. Also I can tell you that the Excelsior right now is as weak as I ever want to see a warp-in go, weaker than that and battles will be ruined by little fragile ships when I need cruisers.
Constellation is too old for warp-in. I also don't like the idea that Type I torps somehow do more damage even tho they're extremely inferior.
Centaur is another one that's too weak for warp-in. Probably too old as well. I don't see a need to use a bicobalt torpedo that is way outdated. Getting a somewhat useful torpedo on veteran rank is too long to wait. If I ever got this in warp-in I would decom it, send it on a suicide mission, or just plain force-fire on it so I can free up a slot. Might as well give me a TOS phaser armed ship so I can kill a K'Tinga.
I like the Apollo tho, in both function and form.
I also don't like the special engine idea, ECM is the only thing that makes torps miss.I hate the Constant class 1) because its stats are near identical for offense and defense, totally not Federation design. 2) I don't like a torpedo that deals extra damage only to cruisers, I mean if making a destoyer bigger makes it take more damage from this torpedo, then making it even bigger should make it take more damage, not less. Also I can tell you that the Excelsior right now is as weak as I ever want to see a warp-in go, weaker than that and battles will be ruined by little fragile ships when I need cruisers.
Constellation is too old for warp-in. I also don't like the idea that Type I torps somehow do more damage even tho they're extremely inferior.
Centaur is another one that's too weak for warp-in. Probably too old as well. I don't see a need to use a bicobalt torpedo that is way outdated. Getting a somewhat useful torpedo on veteran rank is too long to wait. If I ever got this in warp-in I would decom it, send it on a suicide mission, or just plain force-fire on it so I can free up a slot. Might as well give me a TOS phaser armed ship so I can kill a K'Tinga.
I like the Apollo tho, in both function and form.
posted on June 30th, 2010, 3:58 pm
Well, I guess in my attempts to avoid making overpowered ships kinda turned on me.... 
One Word: Balance
Nice to know there are still some Centaur fans out there.
@Nebula
I can understand that the Constant class is a bit fragile. I'll update the stats. And I've done the increased damage to Cruisers because i have never seen any passives specifically making a Destroyer better in later game than earlier game. Most of them become out-dated, the purpose for its passive affect is to give it some usefulness mid through late game.
I though thought that if you liked Nebulas you'd like the Melbourne because of being related. Though I guess some people view it as a nebula rip off with no pod.
Arash8472 wrote:also the point defense better only work for that type of starship instead of covering an entire fleet..? o-o;
One Word: Balance
Tyler wrote:The only reason I didn't vote for the Melbourne-varient of the Nebula is because the Centaur is also there.
Nice to know there are still some Centaur fans out there.
@Nebula
I can understand that the Constant class is a bit fragile. I'll update the stats. And I've done the increased damage to Cruisers because i have never seen any passives specifically making a Destroyer better in later game than earlier game. Most of them become out-dated, the purpose for its passive affect is to give it some usefulness mid through late game.
I though thought that if you liked Nebulas you'd like the Melbourne because of being related. Though I guess some people view it as a nebula rip off with no pod.
posted on June 30th, 2010, 4:08 pm
Last edited by Nebula_Class_Ftw on June 30th, 2010, 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Yeah Arash, it's dogfight range, which is the range of a constructor tractor beam (shorter than short.) I think that is a good way to balance it. 
I think if you want a late-game destroyer you need a weapon that does increased damage to larger ships, with increased damage to cruisers/medium-sized, and much more increased damage to battleships/large-sizes. Being weaker against battleships but strong vs. cruisers will only make it useful in the mid-game (especially if you come up against Puretech who likes his V-13s...)
The pod is what balances the image of the ship vertically, plus those top nacelles look way too small and oddly shaped in the part that connects them to the Saucer (it probably just doesn't scale down very well.) Some kitbashes of models I like (that's how the Nebula itself was made), but this one just doesn't quite work.
I think if you want a late-game destroyer you need a weapon that does increased damage to larger ships, with increased damage to cruisers/medium-sized, and much more increased damage to battleships/large-sizes. Being weaker against battleships but strong vs. cruisers will only make it useful in the mid-game (especially if you come up against Puretech who likes his V-13s...)
The pod is what balances the image of the ship vertically, plus those top nacelles look way too small and oddly shaped in the part that connects them to the Saucer (it probably just doesn't scale down very well.) Some kitbashes of models I like (that's how the Nebula itself was made), but this one just doesn't quite work.
posted on June 30th, 2010, 8:53 pm
posted on June 30th, 2010, 11:27 pm
posted on July 2nd, 2010, 3:25 pm
Well, you don't have to understand Dogfight range. Just think of it as a way to balance it. 
@To Optec and Doca
Is there any of these that are already planned or a good idea for a future patch in your opinions?
@To Optec and Doca
Is there any of these that are already planned or a good idea for a future patch in your opinions?
posted on July 2nd, 2010, 10:29 pm
yep some interessting ideas 
posted on July 3rd, 2010, 5:54 pm
posted on July 4th, 2010, 12:58 am
Optec wrote:yep some interessting ideas
Allow me to introduce another idea.
Angel class - Bravo Fleet InfoBase
However instead of having torpedo's focus the weapons on multiple phasers and high system value.
The idea is to let this unit absorb weapons fire.
Abilities:
Fast Tracking Computers: This vessel has been refitted in order to assault and destroy fast moving vessels that might damage a fleet. The weapons will deal increased damage (by 50%) against short range units. As the modified weapon systems consume many calculation cycles, defense against long-range weaponry is reduced (by 23%).
and
High Density Shield Generators: These modified shield generators create a very dense protective field around this vessel, greatly reducing damage received from weapons fired over a long weapon range (by 50%). Its effectiveness drops if a weapon is fired from closer distances. The shield generators consume large amounts of energy, which reduce the special energy regeneration rate and slightly reduce damage dealt against short range attackers (by 10%), as the energy spikes for weapon systems are lower.
Overall a unit which is designed to absorb damage and hold out until stronger ships arrive to finish cruisers and above.
posted on July 4th, 2010, 1:28 am
posted on July 4th, 2010, 3:59 pm
posted on July 4th, 2010, 6:42 pm
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