The AI could be a bit more challenging
You feel like a battlecruiser is too weak or a race too strong? Go ahead and discuss it here :)
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posted on November 3rd, 2011, 3:42 am
Last edited by godsvoice on November 3rd, 2011, 3:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
Probably have a few gods around here I'm sure.
If it's too easy, instead of adjusting the bars, just give yourself two mercy AI opponents.
The best map for kicking the AI's a$$ is Blue Amber. Battlepit defence is a gimme. Blue Amber is a moon oasis, where you can really use the map as a battlefield should be used. Plenty of strategy in that one, asteroid fields and all. Best way is to build extra constructors and consume the map. Easily beat single AI's of all races, but my favourite is always 2 Feds against Klingons. At one point, I think 3.1.5 beating three AI feds was possible. But teutoberg and recent patches changed that. To do it, I had to play with shroud and fog off though... but still, while it helped with knowing where my enemy was... I still found it very challenging, and were probably the greatest games I've ever played on FO. Three Rommies would never work. It was really the Feds exclusively, but a lot of fun.
In the end, all your looking for is a challenge yes? 3 Hard AI can be fun. But absolutely, it's all based on the maps you use.
Yeah, a big weakness is that AI will focus its attack on your nearest expansion. But Blue Amber is good with that with Multiple Mercies... they attack everything. You really need turrets at all locations or you will be overwhelmed.
I agree, on some maps, you can walk over Merci Ai, but in general... just play against more than one and you've got your tweak.
For some reason, I play a lot of the very first map. You can easily beat the AI if you rush to the centre di/ tri moon and build up your forces there. I've beat all races as Klingons this way easily. But for some reason I always enjoy it (despite easiness), but Blue Amber.. for sure the best map for AI gameplay.
If it's too easy, instead of adjusting the bars, just give yourself two mercy AI opponents.
The best map for kicking the AI's a$$ is Blue Amber. Battlepit defence is a gimme. Blue Amber is a moon oasis, where you can really use the map as a battlefield should be used. Plenty of strategy in that one, asteroid fields and all. Best way is to build extra constructors and consume the map. Easily beat single AI's of all races, but my favourite is always 2 Feds against Klingons. At one point, I think 3.1.5 beating three AI feds was possible. But teutoberg and recent patches changed that. To do it, I had to play with shroud and fog off though... but still, while it helped with knowing where my enemy was... I still found it very challenging, and were probably the greatest games I've ever played on FO. Three Rommies would never work. It was really the Feds exclusively, but a lot of fun.
In the end, all your looking for is a challenge yes? 3 Hard AI can be fun. But absolutely, it's all based on the maps you use.
Yeah, a big weakness is that AI will focus its attack on your nearest expansion. But Blue Amber is good with that with Multiple Mercies... they attack everything. You really need turrets at all locations or you will be overwhelmed.
I agree, on some maps, you can walk over Merci Ai, but in general... just play against more than one and you've got your tweak.
For some reason, I play a lot of the very first map. You can easily beat the AI if you rush to the centre di/ tri moon and build up your forces there. I've beat all races as Klingons this way easily. But for some reason I always enjoy it (despite easiness), but Blue Amber.. for sure the best map for AI gameplay.
posted on November 3rd, 2011, 1:35 pm
Last edited by beserene on November 3rd, 2011, 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Adm. Zaxxon wrote: I can beat the Merci AI, does that make me a god?
AI "skill" depends quite hard on (option menu) settings and race.
A normal merci Fed is no threat at all, a hard merci romulan is....
@godsvoice: beating 3 allied (!) normal merci dom / rom is easily possible alone - ofc with heavy defense play at start and depending on map, not sure about hard + merci setting.
posted on November 3rd, 2011, 1:51 pm
Allied Merci is tough, because you have to focus on their expansions. Beating rom, or dominion Merci is the hardest as I have found, but if you do it on a map you know well, and keep them from setting up mining at their expansion, they will focus all their efforts on completing it. Eventually, you can occupy the set yourself, and if that happens the AI almost gives up. They try to complete their build list but end up messing it up and getting really bad combinations of ships, and it becomes easy to clean out their main base.
posted on November 4th, 2011, 4:52 am
Yes, I was referring to playing 3 Merciless AI. 3 normal Romulans and Dominion wouldn't be much of a challenge... I agree. But three Merci Romulans would destroy you on almost every map, if no cheating is involved. Battle pit defence is really a pretty strong map.
I'm slightly confused when you state 3 allied normal merciless. Is it 3 allied Normal? Or 3 allied Merciless? On 98% of the maps, 3 allied merciless against you alone is pretty difficult. I only managed to do it with shroud and fog off, even against Feds who are decently playable when its against the AI (with my playing Klingons). Battle pit defence is pretty strong.
But Blue Amber is an incredible map. If you want to just beat 1 Ai merciless, put the AI in the bottom left corner. And take the upper right centre, either to the side of the map, or near the centre at the top. Not at the very top, right. At those spots, you can expand VERY quickly, but the AI is cramped by the asteroid field. Not only that, but the AI naturally expands to the other side of that belt, but doesn't fully fortify it. So that is the first expansion you harass, and with a good fleet you can do all the damage in the world before the AI's main fleet at their home base swings around the belt to defend. Then you just retreat, and keep pounding back and forth. If they do heavily defend it, they've left somewhere else unprotected, so attack it instead.
Some smaller maps though make even 1 merci very hard to beat. Especially if you only get one expansion. Beating merciless is easiest when you can expand faster than AI and get real resources to fight with, hence Blue Amber. On maps where I can't expand well, or don't know the map, yeah I have a hard time. But even some of the small ones with just one expansion I can win... so it really depends. Not only the map, but the race you play as, and the AI race you are against. Klingons I'm best at, against Feds, or any of the others. Federation I'm pretty good. It declines from there, lol. But Romulans I'm starting to get the hang of, I just find there early game really tough. Dominion is playable, but I don't understand how to set up their economy, with di tri and supply moons going. And their build orders. bla bla.. anyways.
but back to what you were saying Beserene, and what the topic is... The AI could be a bit more challenging... well, if you only play it on normal no wonder it isn't challenging. So really, I think it's the merciless AI that warrants discussion. And if you can beat one, play more. Two Merciless and one Hard is extremely tough. I've done that with shroud and fog on, but the problem is by the time you beat one, the other two have become stronger, and the time it takes to beat down one of those remaining two, you pretty much leave the other untouched, and once you gut yourself and take heavy damages to beat down the second, the third sweeps right over you. So you really gotta balance your attacks, with effective fleets management. I think AI can give anyone a challenge... except for maps where the limit is 1 merciless AI, then I am much more understanding. But for maps with more than one player option, start playing multiple Ai, and I believe it is a much more enjoyable game.
I'm slightly confused when you state 3 allied normal merciless. Is it 3 allied Normal? Or 3 allied Merciless? On 98% of the maps, 3 allied merciless against you alone is pretty difficult. I only managed to do it with shroud and fog off, even against Feds who are decently playable when its against the AI (with my playing Klingons). Battle pit defence is pretty strong.
But Blue Amber is an incredible map. If you want to just beat 1 Ai merciless, put the AI in the bottom left corner. And take the upper right centre, either to the side of the map, or near the centre at the top. Not at the very top, right. At those spots, you can expand VERY quickly, but the AI is cramped by the asteroid field. Not only that, but the AI naturally expands to the other side of that belt, but doesn't fully fortify it. So that is the first expansion you harass, and with a good fleet you can do all the damage in the world before the AI's main fleet at their home base swings around the belt to defend. Then you just retreat, and keep pounding back and forth. If they do heavily defend it, they've left somewhere else unprotected, so attack it instead.
Some smaller maps though make even 1 merci very hard to beat. Especially if you only get one expansion. Beating merciless is easiest when you can expand faster than AI and get real resources to fight with, hence Blue Amber. On maps where I can't expand well, or don't know the map, yeah I have a hard time. But even some of the small ones with just one expansion I can win... so it really depends. Not only the map, but the race you play as, and the AI race you are against. Klingons I'm best at, against Feds, or any of the others. Federation I'm pretty good. It declines from there, lol. But Romulans I'm starting to get the hang of, I just find there early game really tough. Dominion is playable, but I don't understand how to set up their economy, with di tri and supply moons going. And their build orders. bla bla.. anyways.
but back to what you were saying Beserene, and what the topic is... The AI could be a bit more challenging... well, if you only play it on normal no wonder it isn't challenging. So really, I think it's the merciless AI that warrants discussion. And if you can beat one, play more. Two Merciless and one Hard is extremely tough. I've done that with shroud and fog on, but the problem is by the time you beat one, the other two have become stronger, and the time it takes to beat down one of those remaining two, you pretty much leave the other untouched, and once you gut yourself and take heavy damages to beat down the second, the third sweeps right over you. So you really gotta balance your attacks, with effective fleets management. I think AI can give anyone a challenge... except for maps where the limit is 1 merciless AI, then I am much more understanding. But for maps with more than one player option, start playing multiple Ai, and I believe it is a much more enjoyable game.
posted on November 4th, 2011, 8:03 am
godsvoice wrote:I'm slightly confused when you state 3 allied normal merciless. Is it 3 allied Normal? Or 3 allied Merciless? On 98% of the maps, 3 allied merciless against you alone is pretty difficult. I only managed to do it with shroud and fog off, even against Feds who are decently playable when its against the AI (with my playing Klingons). Battle pit defence is pretty strong.
Acualy there are 2 game settings.
One is the ai selection box, the other is in your game options menu, if you set the game difficulty to hard.... the ai goes insane. the borg sapms cubes, fed build thousands of ships, the dom are domineering, the romulans are a fucking nightmare, and the klingons are quite hard aswell
posted on November 4th, 2011, 9:17 pm
Last edited by godsvoice on November 5th, 2011, 5:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
oh.
i have no idea what I play.
maybe i'm playing 1 ai normal merciless
i wonder what 1 ai merciless merciless would be like.
or are game setting easy, medium, hard? if that is the case, .... hmm id have to check it out. not sure.
edIT: yeah, out of easy, medium, hard. I am always playing hard. out of normal hard merciless. it is merciless
so hard merciless. X 2 +
i have no idea what I play.
maybe i'm playing 1 ai normal merciless
i wonder what 1 ai merciless merciless would be like.
or are game setting easy, medium, hard? if that is the case, .... hmm id have to check it out. not sure.
edIT: yeah, out of easy, medium, hard. I am always playing hard. out of normal hard merciless. it is merciless
so hard merciless. X 2 +
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