Risner needs fixing up: MEDIC!!

posted on May 7th, 2009, 6:08 pm

Probably for the same reason Humans resemble Vulcans; Coincidence.

posted on May 7th, 2009, 6:12 pm

*cough* Progenitor *cough*

...and why they produce viable offspring eh?

[Tyler]

posted on May 7th, 2009, 6:26 pm

Last edited by Tyler on May 7th, 2009, 6:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Writer screwup? So they could get Spock in? Does it matter when it can happen in canon?

As far as I remember, Vulcans decended from a different race. Sargon's people, I think. It was implied, at least.

posted on May 7th, 2009, 10:12 pm

The common traits of many races in our Galaxy were more or less explained in the TNG episode "The Chase":

http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/The_Chase_(episode)

posted on May 7th, 2009, 10:37 pm

Vulcans are believed to be decendants of Sargon's people (the Vulcan page mention's Vulcan possibly being colonized by them), with no realation given between them and the Progenitors. The 'Ancient humanoid' page says they likely related to the Vulcans, but doesn't confirm it.

It was never specified which races were related to them (except maybe Humans), people assume it was the ones that found the message.

[Lt.Cdr.White]

posted on May 7th, 2009, 10:42 pm

Last edited by Lt.Cdr.White on May 7th, 2009, 11:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Well, it is more than likely that many, many, species were involved. After all, it's even likely that almost all similar humanoid lifeforms (those that are so closely related to each other that a coincidence would be highly unlikely) were the result of this.

The fact that Klingons, Cardassians, Humans and Romulans were part of the plot points to the fact they were indeed all related to the ancient humans.

And Star Trek lore has it as a fact that Romulans and Vulcans were once one people... why else would the TNG episodes "Unification I + II" be about Spock trying to promote the reunification of the two peoples?

Also, given the fact that the seperation between Romulans and Vulcans happened in the 4th century of our time, this would mean nothing concerning the ancient humans who did their thing billions of years ago. Thus, if Romulans possess traits descending from the ancient humans, Vulcans have to, too.

Edit: Concerning the Romulan-Vulcan thing: Now I see what you're talking about. There a in fact some contradiction canonical sources about this. TOS points to Sargon's people having to do with it, TNG and ENT support the Awakening time theory which I quoted.

Both are possible, but non has yet been proven 100% correct. It seems more sources point to the Vulcans who left in the time of Surak, though.

posted on May 8th, 2009, 12:21 am

The fact that the Cardassians, Klingons & Romulans were there shows that they were present when a recorded message (made by people who didn't what race would see it) was unlocked.

posted on May 8th, 2009, 3:47 am

I think they all look the same because they though that worfs makeup too took long to do.

posted on May 8th, 2009, 8:55 am

The fact that the Cardassians, Klingons & Romulans were there shows that they were present when a recorded message (made by people who didn't what race would see it) was unlocked.

Well, the one thing is interpreting the intent of the writers... which clearly points to this direction.

The second thing is the fact that the ancient humans had a message that doesn't differentiate between the bearer of the information pieces and the ones who put it together, somehow thinking they would either be the same or at least involved in the whole thing.

The third thing is that the Romulan in that episode indeed seems to accept a relation between Humans and Romulans, thus somehow supporting the theory that there is more to it than just a few species involved.

[Anonymous]

posted on May 8th, 2009, 8:53 pm

Last edited by Anonymous on May 8th, 2009, 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

well the progenitors seeded the galaxy. Sargon's people claim to have seeded vulcan and earth etc.

i dont see a major contradiction there. Sargon's ppl would have been seeded by the progenitors, and then they seeded earth.

the puzzle provided a rather convoluted pattern that didnt actually specify earth or vulcan as a starting point or major point. It was just an abstract dna oriented correlation.

a good example is the romulan acknowledgement.. in fact the Romulans are themselves from Vulcan. Yet at the time of the puzzle were considered romulans from romulus. Sargon's people would have played a similar role in the chain.

-- interesting we're discussing the progenitors in Risner's thread lol..

posted on May 10th, 2009, 3:23 am

Well, I played a game with Mort as federation and decided to use Risner. To be quite honest, I didn't really think she was broken.. Mort was Romulan btw. First thing I did was build starfleet engineering, and get to t2 chassis. Then I started to build akiras, by the time the first one was done, Mort had a good sized fleet of oh..4 or 5 rhienns. So I hit those with a sta-com spawn while the second one finished.

To make a note, this game lasted a while, Mort got to rex's while i got to defiants (tho I never used them). We fought over the extra moons, me with akiras and the occassional descent while he used rhienns and leevhals. I built about 3 remores next and used the precision strike ability to pick off his leevhals, which forced him into attacking my base to survive.

I sent my entire fleet to his base while my excel 2s, which had been building, defending me. Battle lasted a couple minutes, and in the end, I ended up winning. Not sure what makes her broken, since Romulans are the best early game rushers... I didn't use any canavarals either, just about oh 7 Akiras, 2 Descents, and 1 Nebula in my final fleet with 4 excel 2s and 2 akiras defending my base vs 10-12 leevhals and 4-5 support rex's..

Could need some more testing, seeing as i didnt get to the avalon or phalanx point, but it seems alright to me early-mid game.

posted on May 10th, 2009, 5:47 am

the reason that we think that Risner is broken is because she is weak as compared to Mayson. You mentioned that you used excelsior 2s since you used Risner you didn't even get their special weapon. Her special ships are not very useful and thats mostly the point.

[Dominus_Noctis]

posted on May 10th, 2009, 3:04 pm

Last edited by Dominus_Noctis on May 11th, 2009, 7:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

@ Veronw: Honestly, if Mort had that many Rhienns he should have been able to whip you quickly (he should have had closer to 7-8 Rhienns with Risner's slow build). Having no ships that early in the game is a death sentence (you won't be able to expand at all). Plus isn't the Akira medium range? He could have just outmicroed you with Rhienns that early (especially considering Akiras do a large proportion of their damage by torps).... and Leahvals against the Federation?? (I'm also surprised he introduced Generixs so late in the game). Did either of you harass at all? I think you are correct with your final statement: definitely need to test that more because unless you are leaving a lot out of your game, it seemed a lot less action packed than I would expect... May I suggest playing a few games with Le_Deimos, I'm sure he'd be willing to test your Risner strategy out.

EDIT: Yup, Akira medium range, and much slower than Rhienn.

posted on May 10th, 2009, 3:17 pm

well i usualy play as federation and dunno much about romulans but next time i'll be better prepared... at least i hope so 

posted on May 10th, 2009, 4:16 pm

Indeed, I remember that every time we've played together you've chosen Federation