Star Trek Armada II: Fleet Operations

In the next version, I think ALL ships should have a self destruct regardless of size. They don't all have to have as big an explosion (obviously :lol: ) but Self destruct is clearly a part of almost ALL ships in trek cannon, and thus ALL ships, including construction ships, scouts etc.. Should have it. I know it makes it harder to capture an enemy ship, but I've done it before. It just takes skills ;)   Also, Most, if not all ships should have tractor beams. Now I'm not advocating ventures towing Negvars, just hear me out. Tractor beams should be attached to size classes. :D  Thus only a frigate or something larger can tow another frigate. ;)  This is also a major part of trek cannon.  And lastly I think it would be more realistic if the Galaxy, nebula Soverign, and Descent had long range probes along with the Caravel. ;)  (because Galaxys and nebulas have had long range probes in Trek episodes, thus Soverign and Descent would too. Logically. ;) )

Maybe a tug should be added to each race that has a tractor beam for tow disabled or derelicts back to base, what do ya folks think?

I think all ships should have self-destruct as well. But just have the special weapon added to the files and players who want it can add it to every ship if they wish. Same with Warp drive - think about it if the team added it as files and graphics, sounds and such you can make the people who keep requesting it to shut up. They can add in to the ships if they want to.

This would make so many more people enjoy the game and word of mouth will spread the mod to new heights. Just my two cents!

well, the tug would be quite useless, since it's not often that a ship is crewless, it usually just gets destroyed.

yhea i agree a tug would be prety useless, however a tractor on a con ship has its uses, cuz the odd ship or two does get crewless and with mixed tech could mkae it useful to nick a ship or two without crew

Actually, a tug would be useless if ALL ships had tractor beams. UNLESS the tug could tow ANY ship, thus not neccesitatign a Soverign to tow a negvar out of a nebula. :D  I've already added self destruct to all my ships, but I thought it'd be nice to suggest it as a universal change. ;)  

And what use do we have out of a self destruct ability for all ships?
You forget that if this should become reality the blowups should have an incredible power to be canon. Result would be a bad RTS because you could simply fly into a base and blow all ships up. Game over.
To fit it into an RTS it mustn't be too strong but that wouldn't be canon then.
We are, again, at the point of conflict between RTS vs canon.

Then to be blunt; make the explosions of reasonable size, and sacrifice the needs of the minor cannon to supply the needs of the major. ;)  

yeah it's a problem, but i still think that all battleships should have self destruct sequence, and the blast shiuld be strong enough to lower the shields on a destroyer.

I'd say a tractor beam and self-destruct on all Adv. starships would be good.  I think their offensive damage should be minimal, but you should be able to click it before your shields go down so you at least don't give an advanced ship to an enemy.

In stock A2, when you beam over to a new startbase, you can't recrew for about 5 seconds.  Do the same for the self-destruct so it can't be turned off within a time by anyone but the original owner's team.

in fact
the only way Self-Destruct would/should be truly damaging
is if you have said ship in a tractor beam.

all Romulan ships should have self-destruct.

all ships should have self destruct and the weapon should be extremely powerful for example

A sov self destruct should destroy anything within close proximity Bar i dont know a BB  

There are 2 precedents I can think of off-hand for self-destructs not being very powerful.   The first is in Star Trek III.  The BoP is within fairly close range of the Enterprise, yet when it explodes, the BoP isn't noticably damaged.  In fact, it still manages to fly across the galaxy, past warp 10 around the sun, and back again afterwards.

The other is in an episode of TNG when the (was it Saratoga?) is destroyed when its anti-matter containment field deteriorates and blows up VERY close to the 1701.  Again, little to no damage.  

If a BoP was right on top of the ship, fine, it'll be downed, but the damage radius shouldn't be very far.  Maybe max it out as 1/4 of the length of the ship (or less).  The ship isn't packed like a bomb full of explosives, it's just enough to destroy key systems (or secrets) and let the vacuum of space finish it off.

i'd like it if the self destructs power varied with the size of the ship blowing up - i.e a scout will do minimal damage, a sovergien doing much more to close range ships as they carry quantam torps and normal torps etc these wud make the blast more powerful yeah?

then again I would like to see the Sovi and others run out of torps, and gain expirience, but... the fact is for the sake of balance, and limitations on the engine :P

Yeah self destruct does seem logical, but I would rather keep it to the dominion as it seems like on of their tactics.  

I'd like to see either tractors or a destruction option (but not both)... Having a capitol ship like an Avalon or V15 or one of the other heavy ships, with all its shields and/or weapons intact fall behind a retreating group because its engines are off line suxors.  :mad:

Being able to tow these out of harm's way (as must have happened to Ent-E at the end of nemesis to get her back into a starbase) or blow them up once they're surrounded by hostiles would give a better option then just letting them sit out there for 5 minutes until their engines come online or they're set upon by an enemy battlegroup.

Of course, being able to exact a little revenge when you're in an enemy base and all your escorts are gone is just my ebil side talking.  :sweatdrop:  but towing away decrewed enemy ships that have been pummeled but not totally destroyed (rare in FO I know) is nice too.  

The self destruct should be highly damaging, but only in a very small radius ;)  

Agreed, but I REALLY dont want some online hotshot flying into my base with a ****load of sarbes and blowing up my whole frakking base, so I have to say ONLY THE BIG SHIPS GET THE BIG BOOM.

True, A Saber's self destruct should only be damaging in a miniscule radius and it should have about enough punch to disable a venture :lol:  

Also, there is the small matter that shockwakes don't carry in space...

Apparently Dominion HypSpace warhead shocks, Tri and quad cobalt torp shocks and such do now :P  

It could be argued that they arn't true shokwaves, but waves of plasma/other energy forms...

About the whole self destruct thing:

A ship with Self Destruct is not a "flying bomb". Self Destruct is used to prevent an enemy commandeering your ship. It's a defence, not a weapon.
Therefore that's pretty much all it should do: destroy the ship itself.

Very true.  I just don't know how we would prevent people from utilizing it as such should it be implemented.  Would it be possible for the button to appear only when one or more of several conditions apply?  

If it is, than the conditions I suggest would be:
1) The ship is being boarded
2) The ship's engines are inoperative
3) The ship is under 1/8 hull integrity.

Oh, and welcome back, Atlantis!  :D

Nah! Id say have it all the time, just make it so that the sequence only damages the ship itself ;)  

that would prevent other races from stealing your ship without having to beat the hell out of it first! :lol: ;)

that could work, but then it would render the borg holding beam useless, as any halfway decent player would just blow a caught ship up immedeatly...

Well since the SDS (self destruct sequence) is a special weapon (technically) then have the holding beam weaponclass bisable the SDS weapon.

Just a quick idea, that came to my mind when i read this.

In another thread we are talking about "heroes" for every race, mabe the feds get picard and with him a anti borg specialist, with a kind of auto self destruct when boarded.
It destroyes itself when it has a very low crew NOT when its just hit by a holding beam.

AS i said, a quick idea, what do you think ?

that's a fantastic idea!!!

thats a fantastic idea!! :D  No SD in a borg holding beam, unless you've got Jen Luc's special bonuses :D  

Then you can blow up your hero ship. . .  :unsure:  Yay.

Well, I guess it's better than the Borg getting it...

no i see it more along the lines of a bonus to the avatar, enterprises and other big ships could have the destruct and stop the boarding parties taking control of a powerful ship

The point is that its more trekkish is you have all ships equipped with a SDS. ;)  

I dont think we should even have sds because its a waste of time effort and RAM.  i don't ever use them

it would be usefull in the bigger ships as a defensive option

you have to have quick hands- besides id rather go out "with all phasers and torps firing"

when you have boarding parties and borg holding beam on your ship your not doing anything! may as well take the ship with you instead of surrendering it ;)

true(desperately trying to find an answer on the internet)

what do you mean?

i mean i was wrong and trying to find something to prove i was right
 

i see. there is no right or wrong here, only my view. only that is important :)  

but what is right is important

lol Adama, Frodos still winning.

and now?

He's still winning.

still winning :)

more to the point, self destruct on hero ship classes, like sovvie and galaxy could do minimal damage to nearby ships. the other ships can just blow up if it isn't possible to limit the self destruct to certain ships

It should be low damage, since the only thing that would hurt the other ships is the debris from the blast.

some debris could penetrate the shields too. it makes sense for something that big to deal a bit of damage to the shields at least

Oh yes, because even the little pieces would do damage to the shields.

yeah, hey even though Data died in the films he can still live on in FO. some of the debris from the sovvies could be a boarding party in the form of Data ;) he could land on an enemy ship that is caught in the blast and take it over :D

I can just hear Black Baron and Hypercube hurling obscenities at you from beyond the grave...

hey..listen, he did it in the film

its canon :)  

*in creepy hypercube voice*  Noooooo, it disturbs the balance!  the BALANCE!!  OOOOOOAAAAHHHHHGGGHHHHHH!!!!!

ye gods he's right! *faints*

*ominous music plays*

*"Eminem - My Name is" comes on*

*shudder*

go to sleep my american beauty contest winner dallas, texas 2005 and pheonix, arizona 2006!

Speaking of sleeping, I must bid thee farewell.  Until next time!

*crashes through the window in dramatic exit*

toodles pip

I have... returned...   *dramatic music plays*